Minding my own business

Casual discussion amongst spiritual friends.

Minding my own business

Postby thornbush » Tue Apr 14, 2009 6:47 am

As the title suggests...
Where do we draw the line on that? Where do we not draw the line on that?

Opinions? :thanks:
thornbush
 
Posts: 148
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2009 12:22 pm

Re: Minding my own business

Postby Fede » Tue Apr 14, 2009 10:32 am

I'm getting a feeling of deja vu...... :jumping:

For me, to witness something directly, which seems to contravene one or more of the 5 precepts, is sufficient to warrant my poking my nose in where it might be both unwanted and unwelcome.

"For Evil to triumph, it is sufficient that good men do nothing".

(Attributed to Edmund Burke.)

Can't stand by and watch, I'm afraid......
"Samsara: The human condition's heartbreaking inability to sustain contentment." Elizabeth Gilbert, 'Eat, Pray, Love'.

Simplify: 17 into 1 WILL go: Mindfulness!

Quieta movere magna merces videbatur. (Sallust, c.86-c.35 BC)
Translation: Just to stir things up seemed a good reward in itself. ;)

I am sooooo happy - How on earth could I be otherwise?! :D


http://www.armchairadvice.co.uk/relationships/forum/
User avatar
Fede
 
Posts: 1182
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:33 pm
Location: The Heart of this "Green & Pleasant Land"...

Re: Minding my own business

Postby genkaku » Tue Apr 14, 2009 11:39 am

Dear thornbush -- Can you describe what, exactly, is NOT your business?
User avatar
genkaku
 
Posts: 416
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 11:14 pm
Location: Northampton, Mass. U.S.A.

Re: Minding my own business

Postby appicchato » Tue Apr 14, 2009 12:38 pm

Fede wrote:For me, to witness something directly, which seems to contravene one or more of the 5 precepts, is sufficient to warrant my poking my nose in where it might be both unwanted and unwelcome.

Considering the ways of the world, that's one TALL order you've carved for yourself there Alexandra... :coffee:
User avatar
appicchato
 
Posts: 1560
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:47 am
Location: Bridge on the River Kwae

Re: Minding my own business

Postby Fede » Tue Apr 14, 2009 2:51 pm

Bhante, tell me about it!!

Fortunately, I do not personally encounter anything major or life-threatening at first-hand, though I am painfully aware many do.... but small beginnings... ripples spread. That's all I can do. Weed a small garden.

:namaste:
"Samsara: The human condition's heartbreaking inability to sustain contentment." Elizabeth Gilbert, 'Eat, Pray, Love'.

Simplify: 17 into 1 WILL go: Mindfulness!

Quieta movere magna merces videbatur. (Sallust, c.86-c.35 BC)
Translation: Just to stir things up seemed a good reward in itself. ;)

I am sooooo happy - How on earth could I be otherwise?! :D


http://www.armchairadvice.co.uk/relationships/forum/
User avatar
Fede
 
Posts: 1182
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:33 pm
Location: The Heart of this "Green & Pleasant Land"...

Re: Minding my own business

Postby Jechbi » Tue Apr 14, 2009 2:58 pm

thornbush wrote:Opinions? :thanks:

I think we draw the line in terms of wise conduct that tends to be conducive for liberation. Of course we're not always going to know what that conduct is, so we just have to do our best.

But for example: If I witness a person in the grocery store physically beating his 3-year-old son, then it's my business. Out of compassion for both of them, I have to step in and intervene so that the child is not seriously hurt. If I decide it's none of my business, that is not conducive for liberation, because through inaction in that moment I forego an opportunity to develop parami, and I become a participant in the abuse by enabling it through unwise tolerance of violence. In a sense, by not "acting" I am still acting out of fear by suppressing my impulse to want to help and finding excuses not to do so.

On the other hand, if I witness a person in the grocery store scolding his 3-year-old son in a manner that I personally deem inappropriate, or not scolding a 3-year-old whom I believe should be scolded, it's none of my business. Out of compassion for both of them, I have to refrain from stepping in to intervene, because the result is likely to be an argument with the father and confusion for the young boy. Basically, I would just be trying to impose "my" standards of behavior on someone else. And even if it's true that I would handle the situation better than that person, it's none of my business.

fwiw

:juggling:
Rain soddens what is kept wrapped up,
But never soddens what is open;
Uncover, then, what is concealed,
Lest it be soddened by the rain.
User avatar
Jechbi
 
Posts: 1268
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2009 3:38 am

Re: Minding my own business

Postby David N. Snyder » Tue Apr 14, 2009 3:17 pm

I suppose there might be some exceptions, but in general:

When it impinges on someone's peace, well-being, happiness, etc.
User avatar
David N. Snyder
Site Admin
 
Posts: 7964
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 4:15 am
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada

Re: Minding my own business

Postby Ngawang Drolma. » Tue Apr 14, 2009 6:26 pm

Daka Thorny, please feel free to mind my business. :anjali:

I take everything on a case-by case basis and never say anything about other people's kids.
User avatar
Ngawang Drolma.
 
Posts: 805
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:38 pm

Re: Minding my own business

Postby genkaku » Tue Apr 14, 2009 7:53 pm

Drolma wrote:Daka Thorny, please feel free to mind my business. :anjali:

I take everything on a case-by case basis and never say anything about other people's kids.


Or pets, I hope. :tongue:
User avatar
genkaku
 
Posts: 416
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 11:14 pm
Location: Northampton, Mass. U.S.A.

Re: Minding my own business

Postby Ngawang Drolma. » Tue Apr 14, 2009 8:19 pm

Pets too! Seriously! :smile:
User avatar
Ngawang Drolma.
 
Posts: 805
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:38 pm

Re: Minding my own business

Postby thornbush » Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:14 am

Once, many many years ago, whilst I was working part time in a shopping complex, a husband and wife came over to my apparel brand counter and started shouting abusive words at her, then took her by her hair and slapped her continuously like it was her annual tight slap day and dragged her away. I called on security and they were led out of the complex and the man had to be dealt with by 3 guards and he was abusive to them too.
My business? :thinking:

What of people who tell you that you're a precept breaker for not being a vegetarian and that your pet should also be one? Their business?
My business to remind them that it is none of theirs? :juggling:
thornbush
 
Posts: 148
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2009 12:22 pm

Re: Minding my own business

Postby Ben » Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:34 am

Hi Thornbush

Your male customer was assaulting another and where I come from that is a criminal offence. Should we step in to protect the weak or vulnerable? Absolutely!
Were you right to call security and get the customer off the shopping complex property? For sure. I would have done it myself.

As for being publically accused of being a 'precept breaker' for not being vegetarian, then:
- You are not in breach of any precepts by consuming meat. There are a couple of technicalities but for the purpose of this argument lets say that you did not see the animal being killed or induce someone to kill on your behalf. The person who accused you of being a 'precept-breaker' is ignorant of the Buddhadhamma. Is it your business to inform this person that they are wrong? Perhaps in a highly charged emotional situation you could calmly ask the person to point out in the Tipitaka where the Buddha says that the consumption of meat is in breach of the precepts. That in itself may silence your erroneous friend.
Metta

Ben
"One cannot step twice into the same river, nor can one grasp any mortal substance in a stable condition, but it scatters and again gathers; it forms and dissolves, and approaches and departs."

- Hereclitus


Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR
Buddhist Life Stories of Australia

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com
User avatar
Ben
Site Admin
 
Posts: 15964
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:49 am
Location: Land of the sleeping gods

Re: Minding my own business

Postby pink_trike » Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:52 am

appicchato wrote:
Fede wrote:For me, to witness something directly, which seems to contravene one or more of the 5 precepts, is sufficient to warrant my poking my nose in where it might be both unwanted and unwelcome.

Considering the ways of the world, that's one TALL order you've carved for yourself there Alexandra... :coffee:


Indeed it is, but how is working with circumstances not practice?
Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.
User avatar
pink_trike
 
Posts: 1038
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:29 am

Re: Minding my own business

Postby appicchato » Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:13 am

pink_trike wrote:Indeed it is, but how is working with circumstances not practice?

Working with circumstances and 'poking my nose in' don't quite equate...to me...especially where other people are concerned...
User avatar
appicchato
 
Posts: 1560
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:47 am
Location: Bridge on the River Kwae

Re: Minding my own business

Postby BubbaBuddhist » Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:50 pm

In re vegetarian pets: Thorny, you should not take e-sangha chat room too seriously. :lol: :toilet:

J
Author of Redneck Buddhism: or Will You Reincarnate as Your Own Cousin?
User avatar
BubbaBuddhist
 
Posts: 640
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:55 am
Location: Knoxville, Tennessee

Re: Minding my own business

Postby Ben » Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:42 pm

Bubbabuddhist wrote:In re vegetarian pets: Thorny, you should not take e-sangha chat room too seriously. :lol: :toilet:

J


Indeed. Some people, like Vets, are qualified to give an opinion. While others who voice an opinion may just be a bored opinionated ignoramus which isn't a qualification for anything except as person to be ignored.
Kind regards

Ben
"One cannot step twice into the same river, nor can one grasp any mortal substance in a stable condition, but it scatters and again gathers; it forms and dissolves, and approaches and departs."

- Hereclitus


Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR
Buddhist Life Stories of Australia

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com
User avatar
Ben
Site Admin
 
Posts: 15964
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:49 am
Location: Land of the sleeping gods

Re: Minding my own business

Postby BubbaBuddhist » Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:48 pm

You musta been eavesdropping last night Ben. :lol:

Anyway, there was advocation of feeding cats a vegan diet, and I lambasted the parties involved; trying to enforce human morality on animals is just ridiculous. I'm a vegetarian; my cats, being carnivores, eat meat, my frogs, also carnivores, eat worms. I no more expect them to be vegetarians than I expect them to follow the Four Noble Truths. There are websites with specious arguments that cats can subsist on a vegan diet, but there is also a very large number of cats who have become blind, crippled and died because well-meaning vegans tried to raise their cats as vegans.

Arghh, don't get me started. :soap: :popcorn:

J
Author of Redneck Buddhism: or Will You Reincarnate as Your Own Cousin?
User avatar
BubbaBuddhist
 
Posts: 640
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:55 am
Location: Knoxville, Tennessee

Re: Minding my own business

Postby Ben » Thu Apr 16, 2009 1:10 am

No John, I wasn't evesdropping!
I'm just all too familiar with the personality type of the fundamentalist vegetarian.
How is Oreo going?
We lost one of our greyhounds, our beloved Blaze about six weeks ago. It broke my heart.
Metta

Ben
"One cannot step twice into the same river, nor can one grasp any mortal substance in a stable condition, but it scatters and again gathers; it forms and dissolves, and approaches and departs."

- Hereclitus


Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR
Buddhist Life Stories of Australia

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com
User avatar
Ben
Site Admin
 
Posts: 15964
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:49 am
Location: Land of the sleeping gods

Re: Minding my own business

Postby BubbaBuddhist » Thu Apr 16, 2009 2:49 am

Oreo is doing great; she made a complete recovery. So sorry to hear about your dog, I know that is a heartbreaking loss.

J
Author of Redneck Buddhism: or Will You Reincarnate as Your Own Cousin?
User avatar
BubbaBuddhist
 
Posts: 640
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:55 am
Location: Knoxville, Tennessee


Return to Lounge

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: gavesako, Mr Man and 5 guests