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What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 8:43 pm
by Jhana4

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 9:39 pm
by daverupa
Sound advice. One additional point might be "use this list to assess your own behavior, and not the behavior of others."

Perhaps this is a good place to leave this image, as well. It's helpful to recognize when one is no longer having an actual discussion - it happens in person as well as on the internet, and is quite common.

:group:

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 10:58 pm
by Kim OHara
:thumbsup:
Both good.
I like this, too:
PEOPLE WORTH TALKING TO (& NOT)
§ 117. “Let an observant person come, one neither fraudulent nor deceitful, one of straightforward nature. I instruct him, I teach him the Dhamma. Practicing as instructed, he in no long time rightly knows, rightly sees, ‘So this, it appears, is liberation from the bond, i.e., the bond of ignorance.’” — MN 80

§ 118. “Monks, it’s through his way of participating in a discussion that a person can be known as fit to talk with or unfit to talk with. If a person, when asked a question, doesn’t give a categorical answer to a question deserving a categorical answer, doesn’t give an analytical answer to a question deserving an analytical answer, doesn’t cross-question a question deserving cross-questioning, doesn’t put aside a question deserving to be put aside, then—that being the case—he is a person unfit to talk with. But if a person, when asked a question, gives a categorical answer to a question deserving a categorical answer, gives an analytical answer to a question deserving an analytical answer, cross-questions a question deserving cross-questioning, and puts aside a question deserving to be put aside, then—that being the case—he is a person fit to talk with.
“Monks, it’s through his way of participating in a discussion that a person can be known as fit to talk with or unfit to talk with. If a person, when asked a question, doesn’t stand by what is possible and impossible, doesn’t stand by agreed-upon assumptions, doesn’t stand by teachings known to be true,1 doesn’t stand by standard procedure, then—that being the case—he is a person unfit to
talk with. But if a person, when asked a question, stands by what is possible and impossible, stands by agreed-upon assumptions, stands by teachings known to be true, stands by standard procedure, then—that being the case—he is a person fit to talk with.
“Monks, it’s through his way of participating in a discussion that a person can be known as fit to talk with or unfit to talk with. If a person, when asked a question, wanders from one thing to another, pulls the discussion off the topic, shows anger & aversion and sulks, then—that being the case—he is a person unfit to talk with. But if a person, when asked a question, doesn’t wander from one thing to another, doesn’t pull the discussion off the topic, doesn’t show anger or aversion or sulk, then—that being the case—he is a person fit to talk with.
“Monks, it’s through his way of participating in a discussion that a person can be known as fit to talk with or unfit to talk with. If a person, when asked a question, puts down [the questioner], crushes him, ridicules him, grasps at his little mistakes, then—that being the case—he is a person unfit to talk with. But if a person, when asked a question, doesn’t put down [the questioner], doesn’t crush him, doesn’t ridicule him, doesn’t grasp at his little mistakes, then—that being the case—he is a person fit to talk with.
“Monks, it’s through his way of participating in a discussion that a person can be known as drawing near or not drawing near. One who lends ear draws near; one who doesn’t lend ear doesn’t draw near. Drawing near, one clearly knows one quality, comprehends one quality, abandons one quality, and realizes one quality.2 Clearly knowing one quality, comprehending one quality, abandoning one quality, and realizing one quality, one touches right release. For that’s the purpose of discussion, that’s the purpose of counsel, that’s the purpose of drawing near, that’s the purpose of lending ear: i.e., the liberation of the mind through no clinging.
Those who discuss when angered, dogmatic, arrogant, following what’s not the noble ones’ way,
seeking to expose each other’s faults, delight in each other’s misspoken word,
slip, stumble, defeat.
Noble ones don’t speak in that way.
If wise people, knowing the right time, want to speak,
then, words connected with justice, following the ways of the noble ones:
That’s what the enlightened ones speak, without anger or arrogance,
with a mind not boiling over, without vehemence, without spite.
Without envy, they speak from right knowledge. They would delight in what’s well-said and not disparage what’s not. They don’t study to find fault, don’t grasp at little mistakes, don’t put down, don’t crush, don’t speak random words.
For the purpose of knowledge, for the purpose of [inspiring] clear confidence,
counsel that’s true: That’s how noble ones give counsel, That’s the noble ones’ counsel.
Knowing this, the wise should give counsel without arrogance. — AN 3:68
NOTES
1. Reading aññ›tav›da with the Burmese edition. An alternate translation would be, “the teachings of those who know.”
2. According to the Commentary, these qualities are, respectively, the noble truth of the path, the noble truth of stress, the noble truth of the origination of stress, and the noble truth of the cessation of stress.
It's from http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... stions.pdf

:namaste:
Kim

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 9:36 am
by Spiny Norman
I can't remember more than 3 things at once. :tongue:

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 1:07 pm
by Jhana4
Spiny Norman wrote:
I can't remember more than 3 things at once. :tongue:
That is an excellent off topic point. People who write articles on the internet love lists and always have something like "5,000 simple things to help with ____". People can only keep so many tips active in their minds at once and not all tips are as valuable as others. Much better would be "a short list of things for ______ that I tried, that produce the most results"

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 1:19 pm
by binocular
I'd add another thing not to do:
Place the responsibility for good communication exclusively on the other person.

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 4:38 pm
by Lazy_eye
Nice blog (now bookmarked), good advice!

I fall into some of these traps on occasion: #2, #3, #4 #6, #12 and #16 all come to mind.

One that I find particularly grating is #9 and its variants -- i.e. someone posts a snarky, combative or dismissive comment and then adds a chirpy "Metta' or :anjali: under it, just to twist the knife another turn... Unfortunately I have probably done this too..

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 7:10 pm
by Monkey Mind
#17 Blame online Buddhists for the poor quality of the discussion.

#18 Disconnect from the Internet and drive to the nearest Dhamma/ Dharma center for some lovely discussion over tea.

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 9:45 pm
by perkele
This lady has some good points to make.
Monkey Mind wrote:#17 Blame online Buddhists for the poor quality of the discussion.
I have done that a lot. Sorry.

Actually, I only come here to blame people.
Hmm...

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 11:10 pm
by Monkey Mind
I'm just observing it is a bit of a paradox. The author does not name the online forum or venue, but she is expressing concern that the internet discussion does not meet certain quality standards.

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 3:00 am
by Ben
daverupa wrote:Sound advice. One additional point might be "use this list to assess your own behavior, and not the behavior of others."
Abso-diddly-lutely!

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 9:49 am
by Spiny Norman
Monkey Mind wrote:#18 Disconnect from the Internet and drive to the nearest Dhamma/ Dharma center for some lovely discussion over tea.
:o You mean talk to real people?! :jumping:

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 9:57 am
by tiltbillings
Spiny Norman wrote:
Monkey Mind wrote:#18 Disconnect from the Internet and drive to the nearest Dhamma/ Dharma center for some lovely discussion over tea.
:o You mean talk to real people?! :jumping:
They have expressive faces, vocal inflections, and body language. And so you do not have to used these dumb things: :smile:

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 10:32 am
by Spiny Norman
tiltbillings wrote:
Spiny Norman wrote:
Monkey Mind wrote:#18 Disconnect from the Internet and drive to the nearest Dhamma/ Dharma center for some lovely discussion over tea.
:o You mean talk to real people?! :jumping:
They have expressive faces, vocal inflections, and body language.
Yes, but what about all the germs? :? :jumping:

Re: What *NOT* to do as an Online Buddhist

Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 10:38 am
by Ben
Spiny Norman wrote:
Yes, but what about all the germs? :? :jumping:
What about them?