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The obvious question about Kamma - Dhamma Wheel

The obvious question about Kamma

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
alan
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The obvious question about Kamma

Postby alan » Sun Dec 16, 2012 1:55 am

...Is how to explain the loss of innocent life.
Wondering how you would answer that question if presented by a friend who was not Buddhist.
Have to admit, I can't. Any ideas on this?

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retrofuturist
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby retrofuturist » Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:05 am

Greetings Alan,

.... without a single reference to kamma.

:candle:

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

befriend
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby befriend » Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:27 am

im not sure if everything is karma or not, but weve all had past lives and have done evil things in these past lives. no one is innocent, in the context of buddhist cosmology.
nothing can destroy a man who has lived a pure life

alan
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby alan » Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:49 am

But how to explain that to non-Buddhists friends, when they ask you "why" this happened?

alan
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby alan » Sun Dec 16, 2012 3:42 am


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Kusala
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby Kusala » Sun Dec 16, 2012 6:55 am

Image

"He, the Blessed One, is indeed the Noble Lord, the Perfectly Enlightened One;
He is impeccable in conduct and understanding, the Serene One, the Knower of the Worlds;
He trains perfectly those who wish to be trained; he is Teacher of gods and men; he is Awake and Holy. "

--------------------------------------------
"The Dhamma is well-expounded by the Blessed One,
Apparent here and now, timeless, encouraging investigation,
Leading to liberation, to be experienced individually by the wise. "

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mikenz66
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby mikenz66 » Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:04 am

It seems to me that the problem is that other religions claim to make life comprehensible, that there is some purpose to it (usually something to do with God). Hence such questions. The Buddha wasn't interested in explaining a purpose, or the specific details of life, only the general problem and what to do about it.

:anjali:
Mike

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Ben
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby Ben » Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:56 am

Hi Alan

Another interesting question to ponder is, 'how can an all-loving and all-powerful god let this happen"?
I understand that the doctrine of kamma can seem to provide cold comfort at times like this, especially as we grasp for some form of explanation or certainty. Having said that, not everything that happens is the result of kamma. In samsara, good stuff happens as does the awful nasty and evil s--t.

Rather than focus on attempting to answer a question that cannot be answered, it may be better to acknowledge that in this moment suffering exists, that this life is fickle and our only real refuge lies is in walking the path. And in walking the path, we are that little bit more able to act for the benefit of ourselves and others. I hope the time is right for political reform on gun control in the US. It just requires the kamma (intention) of enough people to make it happen.
kind regards,

Ben
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

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e: [email protected]..

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DAWN
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby DAWN » Sun Dec 16, 2012 12:42 pm

Sabbe dhamma anatta
We are not concurents...

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Spiny Norman
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby Spiny Norman » Sun Dec 16, 2012 12:56 pm

"My religion is very simple - my religion is ice-cream."
Dairy Lama

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Dan74
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby Dan74 » Sun Dec 16, 2012 1:40 pm

_/|\_

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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby beeblebrox » Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:20 pm


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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby Alobha » Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:34 pm


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gavesako
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby gavesako » Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:42 pm

Bhikkhu Gavesako
Kiṃkusalagavesī anuttaraṃ santivarapadaṃ pariyesamāno... (MN 26)

- Theravada texts
- Translations and history of Pali texts
- Sutta translations

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cbonanno
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby cbonanno » Mon Dec 17, 2012 1:16 am


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manas
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby manas » Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:58 am

Then the Blessed One, picking up a tiny bit of dust with the tip of his fingernail, said to the monk, "There isn't even this much form...feeling...
perception...fabrications...consciousness that is constant, lasting, eternal, not subject to change, that will stay just as it is as long as eternity."

alan
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby alan » Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:44 am

Thank you for your attention. Since no one has answered the question, I'll just consider it a mystery.

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David N. Snyder
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby David N. Snyder » Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:13 am

Image




Sylvester
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby Sylvester » Mon Dec 17, 2012 6:38 am


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Sam Vara
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Re: The obvious question about Kamma

Postby Sam Vara » Mon Dec 17, 2012 12:52 pm

I would have thought that the most obvious question about kamma is how an action can have results (vipaka) for the being that performed the action. (Other than in the most obvious sense that is accepted by all, Buddhists and non-Buddhists alike). This would seem to be more fundamental than the issue over the suffering and death of innocents, in that the answer would show how it works.


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