Lazy_eye wrote:Not intending to mock renunciation. My point, FWIW, was that relationships by nature are involved with lobha -- it's practically the fuel that sustains them --and if one sets about unilaterally trying to eliminate it without the partner's consent, the relationship will either end or suffer. Some rather monstrous situations can be envisaged. What makes for a happy marriage or romantic partnership isn't always (at least at the outset) conducive to swift spiritual progress, and vice versa.
Yes, well said. I'm finally learning this after several relationships and one marriage than ended (well, is in the process of ending) because I am basically a person who is very, very happy by himself, and has a kind of natural inclination to aspire for various forms of renunciation that most people think are crazy or unhealthy. (See my "masturbating without a fantasy" post for example.) It will be interesting to see whether I have finally learned my lesson and can remain single (or possibly ordain) or will the accumulated defilements pull me back into another relationship. Of course there's no way to know, but it's very interesting and I am staying on my toes!
Your post was very, very helpful to me, thanks. "If one sets about unilaterally trying to eliminate it without the partner's consent...." Well said. Of course that was probably Robert K's point as well.
Having said that, it might be interesting to look at whether a sutta that is, as Cooran said, "upalatable" to modern sensibilities is being explained away or interpretted too freely for that reason.