tiltbillings wrote:It does not claim to; however, it seems that some individuals who are practicing this are getting some results that are interesting and seem to be genuine insights, in Buddhist terms, but then the issue is, without a context in which to understand the insights things can get bollixed.
If the insights are devoid of any appropriate context or understanding, what could make them supramundane "insight"?
So, what context must an insight have to alter a person's life?
tiltbillings wrote:There is Right View and there is Right View. It depends, and you just dodged the question.
So you say.
And so you have done, again.
As I've said repeatedly already (and am not inclined to repeat it to you beyond the traditional third time), it is, as mentioned above in the suttas quoted above 1) iterative (i.e. run and circle) , and 2) with Right View as the forerunner to Right (anything else)
Which is all very nice but it does not address the question you are dodging.
tiltbillings wrote:a) Right View is some sort of mindfulness activity?...
b) Cannot really abandon wrong view until one has some sort of actual insight.
Again, see the "run and circle" quote. If you don't accept the quotes, then fine.
You have not at all shown how it applies.
tiltbillings wrote:Wrong view is not just matter of conceptualization, nor is Right View in terms of actually abandoning wrong view just some sort of conceptualization.
Right View itself is
a matter of conceptualization (what else could a "view" be?), and it's the fulfilment of the full Noble Eightfold Path (not the Ignoble Onefold Path of Wrong Mindfulness) that transforms Right View into to Right Knowledge... but again, Right View is the forerunner. Again, see the "run and circle" quote.
Conceptualization is a tool for helping direct behaviour to cultivate bhavana that may give rise to insight. It is only on the basis of insight that self-view can meaningfully be let go. If it were just a matter of conceptualization we would be able to think our way out of samsara. Right View on a mundane level is a conceptual tool, but Right View grounded in insight is the expression of one freedom from self concept.
It perplexes me that you regard my statement "There is no Buddhist meditation without Right View" as speculative in light of the above.
I can see that.
"McMindfulness" or "Just mindfulness" is a sham Dhamma. That is not what the Buddha taught.
It is not pretending to be Dhamma, but it seems that some individuals can have insights arising from the secular mindfulness practice that really point to something more than mere stress release or pain control and has more in common with Dhamma teachings, which is an interesting thing.
As for the supposed dangers of McMindfulness, I don't care to speculate - I am a follower of the Buddha, not other religionists or secularists.
But you have speculated and continue to do so.