Nibbana and regression

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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chris98e
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Nibbana and regression

Post by chris98e »

I don't believe in Nibbana as a state where a being is enternally purified and does not have to worry about minor regressions.
Jhana4
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Re: Nibbana and regression

Post by Jhana4 »

Okay.
In reading the scriptures, there are two kinds of mistakes:
One mistake is to cling to the literal text and miss the inner principles.
The second mistake is to recognize the principles but not apply them to your own mind, so that you waste time and just make them into causes of entanglement.
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retrofuturist
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Re: Nibbana and regression

Post by retrofuturist »

Greetings chris98e,

So you deny the possibility of arahatship and Buddhahood?

What Dhamma exactly do you think the Buddha discovered then?

:?

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
chris98e
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Re: Nibbana and regression

Post by chris98e »

I believe that life has suffering in it, I believe in the 8 fold-path, I believe in kamma etc... Its just that when ever the Buddha talks about supreme enligtment I just find it hard to believe to be tottally blissfull 100% of the time. I think that arahants are more joyful than most people but I don't think that they are joyful all the time.
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DNS
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Re: Nibbana and regression

Post by DNS »

It sounds like you are confusing nibbana/enlightenment with theistic-heaven.

The arahants are not laughing and dancing and doing cart-wheels all day long.

See: http://www.dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=9260" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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retrofuturist
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Re: Nibbana and regression

Post by retrofuturist »

Greetings chris98e,

I'd recommend studying what the Buddha taught about sankharas.

When you understand what gives rise to them, and what does not give rise to them, you may find yourself with more faith in the Buddha's achievements.

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
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cooran
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Re: Nibbana and regression

Post by cooran »

Hello chris,

This teaching by Bhikkhu Pesala may be of interest:

What is Nibbāna? By Bhikkhu Pesala

Nibbāna is extremely subtle and hard to describe. It is not a place like heaven or paradise. The Arahants and Buddhas do not “enter” nibbāna when they die. Nibbāna is not annihilation of the self, since the so-called ‘self’ does not exist — though attaining nibbāna entails the annihilation of egoism. It is blissful, but there is no feeling associated with it. In fact, because there is no feeling in nibbāna it is truly peaceful. Only Noble Ones can know what nibbāna is really like, but we can understand fairly well by inference and constant practise of insight meditation.
The more we understand what suffering is, the better we can appreciate the value of nibbāna, which is the end of suffering. For example, if you burn your hand it is very painful for some time afterwards. However, when the burn heals you don’t feel the pain any more. The absence of pain is a subtle kind of happiness; because there is no pain there now, you feel at ease.
[…article continues at.......]
http://www.aimwell.org/Books/Pesala/Nib ... bbana.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

with metta
Chris
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
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Zom
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Re: Nibbana and regression

Post by Zom »

I think that arahants are more joyful than most people but I don't think that they are joyful all the time.
Even Buddha himself had severe pains when he was ill. So as you see - if you have body and mind - there is suffering.
That's why there is a so called "nibbana with a residue" (nibbana within life) and "total nibbana" (with no residue; nibbana after death).
daverupa
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Re: Nibbana and regression

Post by daverupa »

David N. Snyder wrote:The arahants are not laughing and dancing and doing cart-wheels all day long.
:cry:
  • "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.

- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]
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DNS
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Re: Nibbana and regression

Post by DNS »

daverupa wrote:
David N. Snyder wrote:The arahants are not laughing and dancing and doing cart-wheels all day long.
:cry:
:jumping:

:console: It's okay, just remember the laughing comes with crying:

Image
chownah
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Re: Nibbana and regression

Post by chownah »

chris98e wrote:I don't believe in Nibbana as a state where a being is enternally purified and does not have to worry about minor regressions.
It might be that you don't believe in something like this because you have never noticed somthing similar. Consider: Do you think that you have learned something which makes you different from a baby?.....indeed you probably do believe this....then do you believe that you have been internally changed so that you don't have to worry about regressing back to being like a baby?....you probaly do indeed think that you could not regress back to being like a baby....in other words, once you have knowledge that is firmly taken to heart and fully understood it is unlikely that that knowledge will disappear. I think the Buddha teaches that a main part of the path to enlightenment is to gain knowledge to dispel our ignorance....it seems likely that once we develop that knowledge and understand it fully it is unlikely that we would forget it........I guess.....don't know for sure....
chownah
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