Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

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gavesako
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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby gavesako » Wed Sep 12, 2012 7:37 am

UhBaUnTaUh wrote:They are a commercial company, not theravada.


This can be seen for example from this "Get Rich Quick" amulet produced by the Dhammakaya temple.

(Because of the UFO shape of their main temple near Bangkok, they are also known as the Flying Saucer Cult.)

:alien:
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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby UhBaUnTaUh » Wed Sep 12, 2012 9:33 am

^

The word in the amulet mean "Be rich quickly".

Note : I don't wanna explain about them anymore, because I want to be keep my mine in Kusalakammapada Number 5. However, they are sattas who buddha taught us to make Brhamviha-ra to them, too.

Although, I post in this topic to tell some truth about them that maybe good for anyone who don't have any information to determine.

We can love them, and should be pitying them, but we should know the truth of they, too.
Parking this account.

I have been moved to another account.

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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby gavesako » Thu Sep 13, 2012 1:02 pm

The latest development:

Fringe group must respect wishes of local people

The Dhammakaya Buddhist sect will have to think twice about its plans to appropriate land that is considered to be a public amenity by northeastern villagers.

Without the consent and buy-in of local people, Dhammakaya, a controversial Thai Buddhist sect, is unlikely to be able to set up a successful operation in northeastern Sakon Nakhon province. Dhammakaya was reportedly close to concluding a deal with local land officers to claim ownership of 85 rai at Don Sawan. It planned to set up a new branch in the province, but is facing strong protests from local people.

Prompted by the Sakon Nakhon Mayor Komut Teekathananond, several thousand citizens have signed up to protest against the transfer of land ownership to the sect. In addition, many in the province feel uncomfortable with some of the practices of the sect, which allegedly has a policy of encouraging its followers to make substantial and regular cash donations. Recently the sect's preaching caused controversy after it "analysed" the afterlife of Apple founder Steve Jobs. Critics say the sect was simply capitalising on the late electronics guru's fame in order to encourage its followers to hand over more money. One telling photo showed a protester in Sakon Nakhon holding a sign reading, "We don't want UFOs here", alluding to the architectural shape of the memorial hall of the sect's headquarters in Pathum Thani province.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/opinion ... 90262.html

:alien:

More reports and images from the Thai media:
http://2bangkok.com/forum/showthread.ph ... tion/page4
Bhikkhu Gavesako
Kiṃkusalagavesī anuttaraṃ santivarapadaṃ pariyesamāno... (MN 26)

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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby Slenderman » Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:06 am

Ben wrote:Hi Bhante,

gavesako wrote:The stairway to heaven is all booked up


You need not be a strict Buddhist to find the story of Steve Jobs' life after death very bizarre.

According to the Dhammakaya sect, the late co-founder of Apple has been reincarnated as a mid-level angel and is now living in a six-storey building in a heavenly atmosphere...


Indeed. I remember earlier this year watching a humorous youtube video of three young people interrogating the 'siri' function of the new iphone 4S with questions such as "where is steve jobs, now?". The repeated questioning of the siri function regarding Steve Jobs led to its, a'hem, "emotional" breakdown.

As for someone within the Dhammakaya sect claiming to know the rebirth of the late Steve Jobs - despite it being a flagrant attention-seeking exercise, it does damage to the reputation of the Dhamma within the community.
kind regards,

Ben


I agree 100 % with this. It is damaging, and the guy really has no way of knowing.

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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby Raksha » Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:30 am

Dear Ven. Gavesako,
It's not fair to take potshots at the Dhammakaya Temple :alien: because essentially they mean well, and so everything will work out fine in the end, because good intentions have good results. I believe their legacy will be a completely reinvigorated Thai Buddhism. Instead of indolent, uneducated monks we will have multilingual, graduate monks skilled in satellite TV broadcasting. Instead of passivity and apathy we will have a tradition that is strong and not afraid to stand up for itself. Let's not forget that previously, apart from the odd forest saint, Thai Buddhism was in serious decline.
:namaste: R.

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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby Hanzze » Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:40 am

multilingual, graduate monks skilled in satellite TV broadcasting.

Was that an advice of the Buddha and would that be possible without violating the Vinaya, not to think on the harming caused by "Missionary in the Name of..."

:alien: might be founded in pity but compassion without wisdom is hurtful for many and at least it show that there is very less faith in the Buddha Sasana but a pride build up on tanha and not compassion at all. Every movement (political, religious...) beside the Dhamma-Vinaya, has failed and caused much pain.

Raksha, rather to feel touched, try to think where the different between Dhamma-Vinaya and such illusions could be. No need to get hurt, but a very need to understand. Which of cause is somehow difficult if we have a believe in "I" or something like a "soul".

It is maybe useful to think what money and its use actually means. Decline is natural when we leave it the natural way, and Samsara does not change if we make dramtics in costumes of the saints out of it.

How every, it is really nice of you and well thought to remember some on the danger of critic even it might be a very needed critic.
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby gavesako » Thu Sep 27, 2012 8:34 am

Raksha wrote:Dear Ven. Gavesako,
It's not fair to take potshots at the Dhammakaya Temple :alien: because essentially they mean well, and so everything will work out fine in the end, because good intentions have good results. I believe their legacy will be a completely reinvigorated Thai Buddhism. Instead of indolent, uneducated monks we will have multilingual, graduate monks skilled in satellite TV broadcasting. Instead of passivity and apathy we will have a tradition that is strong and not afraid to stand up for itself. Let's not forget that previously, apart from the odd forest saint, Thai Buddhism was in serious decline.
:namaste: R.


I take your point about the declining state of the Thai Sangha which often does not seem that inspiring and the standards are pretty low. Compare this article:

"Beginnings of Dhammakaya in Isan"
http://isaan-life.blogspot.com/2012/09/ ... ndbut.html

On the other hand, I think your hope for a "brighter future" with Dhammakaya is naively optimistic, not realizing the danger behind the impressive facade:

3.7. Soon after Ānanda had left, Māra the Evil One came to the Lord, stood to one side, and said: 'Lord, may the Blessed Lord now attain final Nibbāna, may the Well-Farer now attain final Nibbāna. Now is the time for the Blessed Lord's final Nibbāna. Because the Blessed Lord has said this: "Evil One, I will not take final Nibbāna till I have monks and disciples who are accomplished, trained, skilled, learned, knowers of the Dhamma, trained in conformity with the Dhamma, cor­rectly trained and walking in the path of the Dhamma, who will pass on what they have gained from their Teacher, teach it, declare it, establish it, expound it, analyze it, make it clear; till they shall be able by means of the Dhamma to refute false teachings that have arisen, and teach the Dhamma of won­drous effect."40

http://www.palicanon.org/en/sutta-pitak ... -days.html

There are plenty of well-researched analyses of the Dhammakaya doctrines which are distorting the Theravada teachings in some crucial aspects. Anyone who is familiar with the Pali Tipitaka texts would be able to see that for themselves (even though Dhammakaya tries to prove that their doctrines are really based on the original texts, though with little success).

However, what is more worrying and a reason for concern is their drive for domination of the Thai Sangha through fostering strong links with influential politicians and business people, and bribing their way to control even the Sangha hierarchy itself so that they can be presented as a new kind of "elite" and model for the rest of the country. They are indeed very well organized and impressively trained, but in a scary way reminiscent of some militaristic movements that we have seen in the past.

They are also trying to dominate the Thai missionary activities abroad: see this new logo of "Wat Europe" network -- their umbrella organization which is supposed to facilitate the propagation of Thai Buddhism in European countries, with the help of Swedish government apparently.
http://wateurope.eu/
Bhikkhu Gavesako
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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby Hanzze » Thu Sep 27, 2012 8:51 am

Wellcome in the lands of illusion :hello: just be sure that you do not cling on anything.

A man searching for fruit climbs a tree to eat his fill and to stuff his garments with fruit to take home. While he is there, another man searching for fruit comes along. The second man can't climb the tree but he has an axe, so he chops the tree down. If the first man doesn't quickly get out of the tree, he may break an arm or a leg, or even die.

This simile shows the perils of looking for true happiness in the wrong place: in sensual pleasures. If your happiness depends on anything other people can take away from you, you're putting yourself in danger. As the Buddha notes, we hope for happiness in sensual pleasures not because they've ever really satisfied us but because we can't imagine any other escape from pain and suffering. If we allowed ourselves to believe that there is another alternative, we'd be more willing to question our strong faith in our cravings and attachments, more willing to look for that alternative and give it a try.

A person searching for milk tries to get milk out of a cow by twisting its horn. Another person searching for milk tries to get milk out of the cow by pulling at its udder.

from Faith In Awakening


...and sometimes its even good to do not disturb somebody who is twisting horns.

I wounder how much sucess they will have with such a flag...

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SEAsian is very inspired by Chinese samples of power as well as happy about the money flow. And they learn really fast, also from the big brothers of Compassion.

But all in all, maybe a great second wave after Tibetans try... 1+1= not 0

Now we soon have the offical Web-site of "Thai Buddhism". If I would like to cry I would love to cry. People will love it, that's for sure.
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby Raksha » Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:20 pm

Thankyou Hanzze for your thoughtful reply, and thankyou Bhante for your scholarship and integrity. I know that you both seek to protect the Dhamma :jedi: ...but I wonder...is there a better way?
My 'naive optimism' is deliberate, because I believe it serves better. If I forcefully oppose the foolishness of beings then I have found that eventually I become a fool too. So instead I choose to see only good in them :console:.
:candle: :buddha1: :candle:

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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby santa100 » Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:03 pm

Another effective way beside maintaining the transparency within any Buddhist organization is to encourage common folks to read and learn more about the Dhamma. People can only be deceived when they're ignorant. But time has changed. The internet revolution has made the Teaching widely and freely accessable to everyone. And the more they read and learn, the less likely they will be deceived by false teaching from false teachers. Sites like accesstoinsight or tipitaka.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page are greatly valuable. The Thai Sangha should make every effort to translate them into the Thai language and open it up to everyone. Through the light of education and understanding, people will naturally know for themselves the right course of action and free themselves from the evil influence of false teachers..

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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby Hanzze » Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:00 am

Raksha wrote:If I forcefully oppose the foolishness of beings then I have found that eventually I become a fool too. So instead I choose to see only good in them

:thumbsup: Raksha, that is great insight and wise. Neither to opposite such things, nor to support such things but wishing them the best, when you can not really help.
The critice also does not go in direction of the normal follower of this sect, even not in direction of leading layman but on those who are really in charge and would not even have the "legal" possibility to do such things, simply stepping offer the Buddha and his Dhamma-Vinaya.

But as Ajahn Fuang similary to you once said:
"When you want to teach other people to be good, you have to see how far their goodness can go. If you try to make them better than they can be, you're the one who's being stupid."


Those who are in a movie, one is not easy able to help them. There would be only a possibility if one is able to bring their teacher out of the movie. But it's good to show people who are not in a specific moie yet, what the movie is about.

santa100 wrote:Through the light of education and understanding, people will naturally know for themselves the right course of action and free themselves from the evil influence of false teachers..

Santa, your thought are well meant, but it's always a matter of the right conditions, or let me say, of the karmic situation of them. Its more natural that people run the wrong ways and it doesn't matter it they read or know the good teachings or not. Everything that would be needed in addition is here all the time, that is, was and will be never a probelm.
You just need to think on normal good aducated people in the west, very view are open to Dhamma. No think on people having not even 10% of "modern" education. There is no such thing as free-thinking, there is following what ever seems to be good.
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Job

Postby jameswang » Tue Dec 10, 2013 10:48 am

Raksha wrote:Thankyou Hanzze for your thoughtful reply, and thankyou Bhante for your scholarship and integrity. I know that you both seek to protect the Dhamma :jedi: ...but I wonder...is there a better way?

I trust truth to be the better way. That's what Ven Gavesako's is trying to reveal about Dhammakaya. Isn't this the same as what the Buddha did when he pointed out the faults of others teachings of his time and place?

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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Job

Postby jameswang » Tue Dec 10, 2013 10:59 am

Hanzze wrote: :thumbsup: Raksha, that is great insight and wise. Neither to opposite such things, nor to support such things but wishing them the best, when you can not really help.

Ven Gavesako is trying to help by providing info. People who are informed would know enough to avoid. If you understand psychological manipulation well enough, you know that it's no small matter. You too are a potential victim.

Evidence of Dhammakaya as a cult of greed and delusion is ample. More people are getting sucked in and harvested. Once a person's belief is co-opted, it's hard to change. So, preventive education is important.

Ven Gavesako is doing what others here are not able and willing to do. If anyone wish to make more comments dissuading him, please learn more about Dhammakaya first.

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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Job

Postby Kumara » Sat Feb 22, 2014 3:03 am

gavesako wrote:If you know the history of the Dhammakaya controversy in Thailand, which goes back at least 20 years, this is just the latest event which stirred up a lot of public debate in Thailand this week. The previous case involved some peculiar Dhammakaya teachings, such as claiming that Nibbana is the "true self" (atta), which the eminent scholar Phra Payutto has criticized in his book "Karani Thammakai".

Is this book available in English?
I'll be away from 20 April. Be well!

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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Job

Postby gavesako » Sat Feb 22, 2014 5:15 pm

No, only in Thai and it is quite thick.
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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby dhammarelax » Wed Jul 01, 2015 9:44 pm

gavesako wrote:Dhammakaya leader saw and described the reincarnation of Steve Jobs! Believe it or not... :jawdrop: :thinking:

Detailed analysis in this article:
http://asiancorrespondent.com/87995/tha ... teve-jobs/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Original article on Dhammakaya website:
http://www.dmc.tv/pages/en/Where-is-Ste ... art-1.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Ajahn Paisal Visalo on possible Parajika offence of Phra Dhammachayo (in Thai)
อวดอุตริ! พระไพศาลชี้ 'สตีฟ จ็อบส์' ฉบับธรรมกาย เข้าข่ายอาบัติปาราชิก!
http://m.thairath.co.th/content/life/285205" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Wat Phra Dhammakaya in Pathum Thani province on Monday stirred an internet controversy when it released an article on its website referring to the afterlife of Apple co-founder Steve Jobs, claiming the American legend has been reincarnated as a mid-level angel dwelling not far from his Apple office in a parallel world.
According to the temple’s website (http://www.dmc.tv" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;), the article named “Where is Steve Jobs?” was in answer to questions about Jobs’s afterlife that had been asked by a man identified as Tony Tseung, a senior engineer at Apple's headquarters in Cupertino, California.

It claimed Mr Tseung sent a letter asking Phrathepyanmahamuni (Luang Por Dhammachayo), the abbot of Wat Phra Dhammakaya, whether he knew where Jobs went after his death and how he was faring.

He said Jobs was a practitioner of Buddhism and at one point wanted to become a Buddhist monk, but failed to do it as work kept him busy.

The website said the answers to Mr Tseung’s questions resulted in knowledge gained from Phrathepyanmahamuni’s long-time practice of meditation.

The abbot claimed Jobs is now “a half Witthayathorn, half Yak (Thai word for ‘giant’), which is a mid-level angel. Witthayathorn is the term representing one of the angel types who love to seek knowledge in various sciences. Another trait of his angelic character was a hot temper, he said.

Before Jobs died, he was worried about many things such as his family and work projects, and his life after death.

Jobs is living in a big heavenly palace, the height of a six-storey building, made of white, silver metal and crystal glass, located not far from where he worked when he was alive. He has 20 servants as a result of his worldly virtue, the abbot said.

The content in the article was from a Phrathepyanmahamuni sermon that had been aired on the temple’s cable television channel Dhamma Media Channel (DMC) last week. It was intended to teach the law of karma to Dhammakaya followers, not meant to defame or insult any parties, the website explained.

The website said the article had been disseminated on many websites and social media channels and the text may have been edited, paraphrased or distorted. As a result, it urged people to use care and read the “correct” original text on its website. It also said the “Where is Steve Jobs?” article was only an individual opinion and whether to believe it was up to the audience.

Wat Phra Dhammakaya has been embroiled in controversy over its donation campaigns and claims of miracles. The temple, however, is believed to have millions of followers around the world, including many powerful Thai politicians.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/308543/null" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



Temple danger clear as Jobs talk gets crazy
Sanitsuda Ekachai

Should we just dismiss it as crazy when a Buddhist monk claims he knows about the late Steve Jobs's afterlife and that Jobs's spirit is now blessed with a sacred crystal ball inside his body?

If this out-of-this-world claim came from a nobody, we could just laugh it off as a wacky idea from someone trying to use the name of a famous person to get himself some attention.

But it's definitely no laughing matter when the claim comes from the almighty abbot of the country's richest and most politically connected temple which _ despite criticisms about its grave distortions of Buddhist teachings _ is set to take control of the clergy.

If you missed Phra Dhammachayo's talk in Thai on the afterlife of Jobs and the stories about his previous lives, go to the Dhammakaya Temple's website at http://www.dmc.tv" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

The abbot's talk is divided into three parts: where Steve Jobs is now after his death, why he was born talented, and why he became a successful businessman in the first place.

The abbot, clad in a saffron garb that is distinctive from mainstream monks, told the audience that despite his good deeds on earth, Jobs's mind was clouded by anxiety and fear before he succumbed to cancer. This is why, he said, Jobs's new form in the afterlife is that of "a middle-class celestial male being in the category of half celestial male, half giant demon" with dark complexion, and complete with hidden fangs which will show when his famous temper takes over.

"Can you follow me?" The abbot asked this question every few minutes as he described in minute detail Jobs's celestial abode _ a sleek, hi-tech six-story building with a floating bed and a 20-strong entourage _ near his old office building.

I admit it was very hard for me follow the abbot although his followers kept on responding to him, exclaiming "oh, wow" and "yes, yes".

The first part of the talk ended with Jobs's bliss and thankfulness after receiving a stream of light and a sparkling crystal sent by a group of Dhammakaya followers into the centre of his body.

Can you follow me?

In the other two parts of his talk, the abbot told of Jobs's previous lifetimes, one in which he was a merchant who donated large amounts to an orderly, serene, well-organised temple (like Dhammakaya?) even when he did not have much money, who became one of the temple's faithful, learned meditation with a monk with special powers (like Phra Dhammachayo?) and attained wealth by always making a strong wish for it after every merit-making (like the Dhammakaya followers are told to?).

Once a target of state suspicion for its rapid growth, Dhammakaya is now enjoying support from both business and political elites as well as urban supporters who are drawn to the temple's hypnotic mixture of grandeur, a sense of modernity, tales of supernatural powers, and the promises for quick nirvana fixes that money can buy.

The clergy, pampered by Dhammakaya wealth and under the spell of nationalism, also support Dhammakaya's overseas expansion, viewing it as part of the propagation of Thai Buddhism.

The temple is also making sure that every new batch of monks is growing on Dhammakaya scholarships to build a firm foundation of support as their members continue to climb up the ecclesiastical ladder.

According to Dhammakaya defector Mano Laohavanich, formerly Mettananando Bhikkhu, the threat doesn't stem only from the abuse of Buddhist teachings on giving for commercial gain. It also affects the very core of Buddhism by turning it into a theological religion.

In his article "Esoteric Teachings of Wat Phra Dhammakaya," he discusses the belief among the temple's inner core members that the abbot is the reincarnation of the "Creator" who is leading an army of the Sons of Light to fight the Sons of Darkness in a cosmic battle to save humankind.

It's just getting weirder and weirder, isn't it?

I just can't imagine what the future holds for Thai Buddhism when the clergy is under Dhammakaya's full control.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/opinion/opin ... gets-crazy" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

:spy:


How does this differ from knowing the reincarnation of the Dalai Lama? I tend to take seriously what the Buddha said and its clear that monks with that ability can see where beings are reborn, I am expressing this not as a support to the specific tradition in general but only to this particular point.

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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby Dhammanando » Wed Jul 01, 2015 10:06 pm

dhammarelax wrote:Who does this differ from knowing the reincarnation of the Dalai Lama?


I've heard that for an infant candidate to get the Dalai Lama job he has to be able to identify objects that he owned in his former life that are mixed together with objects that he didn't own. So there is an empirical test of sorts; it probably wouldn't satisfy James Randi, but it's better than nothing. By contrast, the claims of Dhammachaiyo are made solely on his own authority and gullibly accepted by Dhammakaya followers without any evidence whatsoever.
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cooran
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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby cooran » Wed Jul 01, 2015 10:13 pm

Official statement on issue of reincarnation of Dalai Lama
http://dalailama.com/messages/statement ... ncarnation
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
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dhammarelax
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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby dhammarelax » Wed Jul 01, 2015 10:45 pm

Dhammanando wrote:
dhammarelax wrote:Who does this differ from knowing the reincarnation of the Dalai Lama?


I've heard that for an infant candidate to get the Dalai Lama job he has to be able to identify objects that he owned in his former life that are mixed together with objects that he didn't own. So there is an empirical test of sorts; it probably wouldn't satisfy James Randi, but it's better than nothing. By contrast, the claims of Dhammachaiyo are made solely on his own authority and gullibly accepted by Dhammakaya followers without any evidence whatsoever.


Hi Bhante

Yes but the point in question is not directly the confirmation of the identity of either the Dalai Lama or Mr. Jobs but the initial finding of them, how do they find the candidates to try the object selection in first place, using supernatural powers. So in there lies the similarity.

Having said that and abruptly changing the subject I would like to ask what would be the best way to convince an ardent follower of the Dhammakaya to try a different practice, someone I know is under their influence and after reading things like:


From http://blogs.dickinson.edu/buddhistethics/

"Its elementary meditation teaching is a combination of a simple mediation technique which comprises visualization of a crystal ball or a crystal Buddha image at the level of 2 finger-breaths above the navel around the middle part of the body, and the use of the universal mantra: sammā-arahaṃ."

"When the newcomer has gained sufficient faith in the leadership of the wat, s/he will be introduced to a higher level of the teaching of Vijjā Dhammakāya where the conventional knowledge of Buddhism becomes almost insignificant. Personal enlightenment is no longer the goal of each person’s life. Nibbāna is not the final destiny of life. Through the knowledge of Dhammakāya, the inner body of enlightenment or the True Self of each person, there is another higher abode and bliss that is superior to nibbāna."

"Unlike members of other schools of Buddhism in Thailand who are trained be humble, detached from social phenomena, and always ready to let go of any suffering and pain in life, followers of Wat Phra Dhammakāya are trained to be proud of themselves and to sacrifice anything in their lives for their leaders and the goal of the wat. Being honored as a part of the Army of the Light, they themselves are fighters who have to win every battle for the sake of the Master no matter how hard the assignment. On the contrary, they will be punished harshly if they fail."

"Respect for the commands of the leader is the core of Wat Phra Dhammakāya’s ethos. Such control is neither coincidental nor a part of Buddhism monasticism in Thailand. It is rooted in another frequently told myth of the organizational structure, the prophecy of the late abbot of Wat Paknam Bhasicharoen, who, according to the Venerable Dhammajayo, took Adolf Hitler and as one of his greatest personal icons. According to this story of Refined Dharma, an ideal world would have resulted from the victory of Nazi Germany in World War II. The Abbot of Wat Phra Dhammakāya has been inspired by the success of the Third Reich; it has become the blueprint of for the massive ceremonies and organization of the wat."
"It is strange that for over forty years of the community, the Abbot has never taught anyone how to wage war against the Māras; despite the fact that this is the task he claims as his primary duty. Apparently, the Abbot is the Great Master of Dhammakāya meditation who has kept the ultimate technique of meditation for himself."

I am worried and want to do something, if you know some simple arguments would be great.

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dhammarelax
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Re: Dhammakaya leader 'knows' the reincarnation of Steve Jobs!

Postby Dhammanando » Wed Jul 01, 2015 11:31 pm

dhammarelax wrote:Having said that and abruptly changing the subject I would like to ask what would be the best way to convince an ardent follower of the Dhammakaya to try a different practice,


I only wish I knew. As it is I've no idea at all what things are effective in freeing people from mental enslavement to this ghastly outfit. Perhaps the best person to consult on this would be Mano Laohavanich (the former monk Mettānando) who used to be quite a big shot in the organization but is now very critical of it.

He has two Facebook pages, but I don't know which (if either) is current...

https://www.facebook.com/mano.laohavanich

https://www.facebook.com/manomettanando.laohavanich
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