The easiest and most complete and effective path. Thoughts?

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The easiest and most complete and effective path. Thoughts?

Postby Scott1989 » Sun Aug 26, 2012 2:55 pm

Keep in mind that this is the path that works for me and I realize it might not be the best path for others.

I've struggled for so long to find what works and my path often became too complicated.

After a long time of struggling I came up with this and have found that it works:

1. Tell yourself to live your life as well as you can from now on. Treasure each moment and do the things that are 'right' for you. Learn and develop.
2. Hold mindfulness. Mindfulness of posture, body, thoughts, feelings, etc.
3. Recognize one of these three things (problems) when they arise:
- Ideas of I/me/mine and ideas of me performing an action
- Craving (yes, ANY form of wanting)
- Suffering
These three 'problems' always exist all at the same time or not at all. When there is an idea of I/me/mine and thus an idea that you are performing an action, there is craving and thus suffering, because you have become identified with an object. When there is suffering there is craving and when there is craving there has to be an identification with an object. Also, when there is craving, there is ALWAYS suffering. Some people don't realize this, but when there is craving, that means that the present moment is not good enough, which means there is suffering. So recognize these three things when they arise and remove the craving (and thus all three of them at the same time) by thinking 'this is delusion'. This is true because these things only happen when you are identified whith an object and dualistic thinking arises. This is always delusion, because you are not an object and thus 'you' cannot do anything. Don't try to become free of delusions, because then you create another delusion. Just think 'this is delusion' when you recognize one of these three problems and thus realize that 'you' cannot do anything. When you feel it is you saying 'this is delusion' you create another delusion, so recognize that as 'this is delusion' too. Now you will be back on the path. Practicing mindfulness is the key to recognize delusion. When mindfulness is gone, there is delusion. Remembering to live your life fully and right now is the key to mindfulness. Whenever craving is gone, you will always automatically do the thing that is 'right' for you, because there is nothing else left to do.

That's it. No need for the rest of the eightfold path. I've found that trying to remember the eightfold path was too much for me and made things complicated. But by practicing life, holding mindfulness and removing delusions, the rest naturally follows. This works because of mindfulness, which is the key here.

When there is no mindfulness there has to be delusion. When there is mindfulness there can be no delusion, because you are mindful of objects, so you can never be identified with them. In other words: mindfulness IS enlightenment. Even just being aware of your breathing while a feeling or thought arises is enough to know that there is no delusion.

When done right, you will never have the feeling that you are the one doing the work. Things just happen.

Of course, before you will be willing and ready to start this path you will have to understand that there is no 'I' doing anything. Everything happens as it happens and you couldn't have made it happen any other way. Reading up on the 'three marks of existence' is enough to prepare you for this path.

Hopefully this will help some people. If this does not help you or if you believe this is not an effective path, I would like to know your thoughts on it.
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Re: The easiest and most complete and effective path. Thoughts?

Postby SDC » Sun Aug 26, 2012 10:07 pm

I am glad that you have found something that you feel comfortable with.

If the N8P seems overwhelming and in need of further simplification, perhaps you were trying to take it all on at once. Perhaps a more systematic approach would help it easier to follow.
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Re: The easiest and most complete and effective path. Thoughts?

Postby David N. Snyder » Sun Aug 26, 2012 10:16 pm

8 fold path is too much? It is only 8 ?! :tongue:

But seriously, perhaps a little more simplification for now is necessary, as SDC mentioned. Just see it as :

1. Wisdom (Paññā)
2. Morality (Sīla)
3. Concentration (Samādhi)

It looks like you are focusing on the meditation part and from that wisdom can arise, but don't forget sīla.
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Re: The easiest and most complete and effective path. Thoughts?

Postby Caraka » Sun Aug 26, 2012 10:26 pm

I can't say I agree what you say, but it is yours to find out.
Last edited by Caraka on Mon Sep 03, 2012 6:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The easiest and most complete and effective path. Thoughts?

Postby unspoken » Mon Aug 27, 2012 4:42 pm

When there is suffering there is craving and when there is craving there has to be an identification with an object.


identification of objects, can you tell me more about that? Is noting feeling arises and passes identify object?

I've found that trying to remember the eightfold path was too much for me and made things complicated

you cultivate it naturally when you reached a certain stage, you dont memorize words to reach enlightenment

Don't try to become free of delusions, because then you create another delusion.

In this passage here I noticed that your effort on trying to identify cravings for instance, you note it as delusion. And simply ignore it and let it go. The meaning here of creating another delusion is simply because you think that when you notice the rising of such cravings, you, as a person watching it come and go, is a delusion because there is an identification of self in that particular act?

mindfulness IS enlightenment

May I ask that mindfulness exists when there is consciousness? For example, if a person wakes up, conscious that they are awake, they can be mindful, however when they sleep, they are unconscious, they do not know what are they doing, can they be mindful? If mindful only able when there is consciousness, then how can mindfulness IS enlightenment as enlightenment is beyond what is conscious and unconscious?
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Re: The easiest and most complete and effective path. Thoughts?

Postby Magoo » Mon Aug 27, 2012 11:31 pm

Hi Scott,

What you are doing certainly seems like good practice and will be of great benefit to you as it is for me. As you mention 'mindfullness' is the key and as someone else suggested the eightfold path can be broken down into 3.

1. Wisdom (Paññā)
2. Morality (Sīla)
3. Concentration (Samādhi)

It doesnt take much more work or even any more work than what you are already doing. If you practice the Sila component, which any 5 Preceptor does and make this a really strong focus in order to purify your heart, then your Meditation will be better. With better meditation there will arise Wisdom, but also your Mindfulness will grow.

So in my humble opinion what you are doing and understanding is fantastic.

If we put equal effort into the purification process, then we are well and trully on our way.

Good luck and may you be well and happy.

With MegaMetta
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Re: The easiest and most complete and effective path. Thoughts?

Postby Scott1989 » Tue Aug 28, 2012 9:52 am

Your true essence cannot do anything. So you doing something (even looking for your true self) is always identification with an object.

What I meant with 'mindfulness is enlightenment' is that there can be no identification with something as long as you are mindful of what is going on. Of course you are right in saying that your true essence cannot be enlightened or unenlightened because it is always the same.

Thank you all for your answers. Maybe my new post will explain more about this path: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=13751
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