Dhamma Wheel Buddhist Forum

as it says on the tin, "Is critical thinking active vipassana?


it seams to me that it is, but I would like to have your thoughts on this.

I would say it is because it is the application of right effort inwardly to oneself (as described in the video at-least). A looking for the flaws in ones own thoughts, and the philosophies of another (at-least to see if they aim toward the correct place).

Edit -
By Active I am refering to reflective practices within day-to-day activities, reflecting on an action and its motivations/intentions (were they skillful...), or studying a topic such as Kamma (is this understaning coherent...).

PLEASE Watch the video, as the definition for this thread is there.

Cittasanto wrote:as it says on the tin, "Is critical thinking active vipassana?

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it seams to me that it is, but I would like to have your thoughts on this.

I would say it is because it is the application of right effort inwardly to oneself (as described in the video at-least). A looking for the flaws in ones own thoughts, and the philosophies of another (at-least to see if they aim toward the correct place).

I just now logged onto these forums to ask almost the exact same question.

Edit: To add a little more substance to my post, it's interesting to compare critical thinking with Sayadaw U Tejaniya's method of asking questions about your thoughts during meditation.

This a great question and one I've been contemplating for a while now. If you take the definition of crtitical thinking in this video and compare it to the way Rev. Thanissaro, e.g., narrates the Buddha's "method of discovery," then I think you have good parallels to yoniso manisikara (and dhamma vicaya), especially as he describes the Buddha's process in the book Skill In Questions and in essays like " One Tool Among Many: The Place of Vipassana in Buddhist Practice".

And if we look at Albert Elllis' work, e.g., whose Rational Emotive Behavior Therapy (REBT) parallels crtical thinking, the particular aspects of the tilakkhana start popping out. For instance, anicca and dukkha are "covered" in his writings like the chapter in A Guide To Rational Living titled, "Accepting and Coping with the Grim Facts of Life." Anatta, for example, is "covered" in his writings like the chapter in The Road to Tolerance: The Philosophy of REBT titled, "REBT Diminishes Much of the Human Ego." To be fair, there's a chapter in that same book on Zen Buddhism & REBT in which he makes the common mistake of interpreting the Buddha as teaching that life is suffering rather than his actual teaching that here is suffering life. He also critizes "desireleness" there, but I don't think was aware of the distintction in Buddhism betweeen skillfull and unskillful desire. He also criticized Henepola Gunaratana's The Path of Serenity & Insight, but I forget where and what they were specifically. Furthermore, his book, Anger: How to Live With and Without It has helped me tremendously in the Rooting-Out-Hate department. And when you read transcriptions of Thanissaro's talks in his Meditations series like "The Story-telling Mind," "The Path of Mistakes," "Not What You Are, What You Do," "Little Things," "Your Inner Mob," "Inner Voice Lessons," etc..., you have to strongly suspect the Reverend knows a thing or two about REBT and CBT and has incorportated them into his teachings.

twelph wrote:...it's interesting to compare critical thinking with Sayadaw U Tejaniya's method of asking questions about your thoughts during meditation.

For sure. Do you have any of his particular writings or talks in mind?

danieLion wrote:

twelph wrote:...it's interesting to compare critical thinking with Sayadaw U Tejaniya's method of asking questions about your thoughts during meditation.

For sure. Do you have any of his particular writings or talks in mind?

Honestly it's throughout all of his teachings. He is constantly offering up questions for meditators to phrase in their mind. Though I don't think he is as worried about coming to a definitive conclusion like critical thinking might. From his little book on right attitude:

6. Why do you focus so hard when you meditate?
Do you want something?
Do you want something to happen?
Do you want something to stop happening?

http://sayadawutejaniya.org/wp-content/ ... points.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If the point of critical thinking is to analyze a thought in order to question and ascertain certain qualities about it, then what the Sayadaw is teaching seems to fall under critical thinking. I would like to hear someone else's take on it though.

twelph wrote:Though I don't think he is as worried about coming to a definitive conclusion like critical thinking might.

Crtical thinking does not pursue definition or conlcusion. It is iterative, something it shares in common with epistemology (science--from a Latin word for "knowledge"--is just an epistemology of iteration).

twelph wrote:If the point of critical thinking is to analyze a thought in order to question and ascertain certain qualities about it, then what the Sayadaw is teaching seems to fall under critical thinking. I would like to hear someone else's take on it though.

Well, according to the video's conclusion, critical thinking is the art of analyzing and evaluating thinking with a view to improve it. However, It's orientation depends on it's telos, or goal. When combined with Buddhism, the goal becomes quite clear, as you've rightly noticed from Reverend Tejaniya's teachings.

Hi Cittasanto,

That looks good.
A couple of thoughts - it looks similar to mindfulness-based cognitive therapy.
Also, you might be interested in the section in Ven Analayo's seminal work "Satipatthana", on "Investigation of Dhammas" which can be interpreted as self-reflexive analysis.
kind regards,

Ben

What is "Active Vipassana"?

danieLion wrote:Well, according to the video's conclusion, critical thinking is the art of analyzing and evaluating thinking with a view to improve it. However, It's orientation depends on it's telos, or goal. When combined with Buddhism, the goal becomes quite clear, as you've rightly noticed from Reverend Tejaniya's teachings.

As a side note, meditation has the benefit of stilling the mind to the point where evaluating one's thinking can be directly linked to different sensations in the body. When critical thinking talks about trying to determine your own bias, using the body as a frame of reference to notice when you feel strongly about something will help you from falling into these traps.

I believe that several teachers have mentioned that in the west there is a stigmatism associated with being aware of your body. Taking this into consideration, it makes sense that critical thinking (with the current iteration being developed mostly from western philosophy) would lack this portion of the Dhamma.

It starts to get really interesting if you view Plato's "The One" and "The Good" as a form of enlightenment like some scholars have chosen to do.

ground wrote:What is "Active Vipassana"?

not formal so more active.

I will have a proper read of the posts tonight and reply to any.

I don't think of Vipassana as a type of meditation (although the word does apply to a meditative movement) but I think that it is pretty clear that critical thinking is of the utmost importance if we want to develop vipassana. As Ben already pointed out, critical thinking can apply to the investigation of dhammas factor of awakening. Another good use of critical thinking with the aim of improving one's thinking comes from the Dvedhavitakka Sutta (http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;). And as pointed out critical thinking should play a significant role in cultivating right effort as well as appropriate attention.

Hearing the Dhamma, he remembers it. Remembering it, he penetrates the meaning of those dhammas. Penetrating the meaning, he comes to an agreement through pondering those dhammas. There being an agreement through pondering those dhammas, desire arises. With the arising of desire, he becomes willing. Willing, he contemplates (lit: "weighs," "compares"). Contemplating, he makes an exertion. Exerting himself, he both realizes the ultimate meaning of the truth with his body and sees by penetrating it with discernment.

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If the analysis doesn't result in stilling, it's papañca.

No it isn't. critical thinking is about thought based solutions to thought created problems. Vipassana is transformative. It creates a shift. Critical thinking is of the world.

Would be interested to hear from robertk and also from those with a strong "classical" sutta understanding would have to say?

Mr Man wrote:No it isn't. critical thinking is about thought based solutions to thought created problems. Vipassana is transformative. It creates a shift. Critical thinking is of the world.

A sutta response:

"When for you there will be only the seen in the seen, only the heard in the
heard, only the sensed in the sensed, only the cognized in the cognized,
then, Bahiya, there is no you in terms of that. When there is no you in terms
of that, there is no you there. When there is no you there, you are neither
here nor yonder nor between the two. This, just this, is the end of suffering."

-- Ud I 10

This is not a matter of conceptual, critical thinking, and it is something that can be cultivated.