Brian Ruhe and Representation

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
plwk
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Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by plwk »

It is the teachings of other people than the Buddha, and should therefore not be called Buddhism.
82,000 Teachings from the Buddha
I have received;
2,000 more from His Disciples;
Now, 84,000 are familiar to me.

There goes that portion of the Sutta Pitaka... huh :thinking:
Setting aside the Mahayana mythos The Jewel Ornament of Liberation by sGam.po.pa (Author), Herbert V. Guenther (Translator) is a solid Dhamma book.
Agreed although I prefer the more 'readable' version by the Khenpo Konchog Gyaltsen Rinpoche...
However its my opinion that those in Theravada who follow the Suttas, specially the earliest nikayas - the core of the dhamma, is following the words of the Buddha and can therefore in a meaningful and true way be referred to, as Buddhist.
Then Jivaka Komarabhacca went to the Blessed One and, on arrival, having bowed down, sat to one side.
As he was sitting there he said to the Blessed One: "Lord, to what extent is one a lay follower?"
"Jivaka, when one has gone to the Buddha for refuge, has gone to the Dhamma for refuge, and has gone to the Sangha for refuge, then to that extent is one a lay follower."

Right...your opinion ... unlike what the Buddha talked about on who is a lay follower (conveniently known as 'Buddhists' today) and its qualities in the Jivaka Sutta, AN 8.26 ... despite your alleged upholding of 'buddhavacana' earlier...
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mikenz66
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Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by mikenz66 »

jan fessel wrote: Yes I partly agree, there are many things in Theravada buddhism, that should not be called buddhism.

However its my opinion that those in Theravada who follow the Suttas, specially the earliest nikayas - the core of the dhamma, is following the words of the Buddha and can therefore in a meaningful and true way be referred to, as Buddhist.
It is, of course, your choice to have your own definition of what is "Buddhist". However, just as a Theravada practitioner would not accept a Mahayana definition of their practice as "Hinayana", it's not up to you to define those who follow Mayahana teachings , Classical Theravada teachings, or a Secular Buddhist approach as "not Buddhist". And it would certainly be rash to assert that approaches that you have defined as "not teachings of the historical Buddha" do not lead to awakening.

By all means, express your preference for the teachings that you feel are the true Buddha-Vachana. However, please be mindful of the Terms of Service of our Forum:
Badmouthing of other spiritual paths is not allowed.
and
There are a broad spectrum of approaches to, and interpretations of, the Dhamma. Please refrain from wholesale dismissal of a particular view, approach, or teaching style.
:anjali:
Mike
jan fessel
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Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by jan fessel »

I think you have mixed up your qoutations Pwlk.

I have not commented on the Jewel ornament of liberation.

Yes a true follower of the Buddha follow the words of the Buddha, and not of his students.

The Jivaka quote has to be understood in context, with other words spoken by the Buddha.

:anjali:
daverupa
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Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by daverupa »

jan fessel wrote:Well ...it seems as there is Christians who not agree with you.
I'm more interested in academic opinion in this respect; and, to that extent, Mahayana is based on the idea of Buddhas, while Theravada is based on the historical Buddha. They each have commentarial velocities as a result of their prevailing foci, but they count as Buddhism each to this extent.

It simply shows that Buddhism is a very, very broad term, and that's without even talking about the Tibetan religions.
  • "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.

- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]
jan fessel
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Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by jan fessel »

daverupa wrote:
jan fessel wrote:Well ...it seems as there is Christians who not agree with you.
I'm more interested in academic opinion in this respect; and, to that extent, Mahayana is based on the idea of Buddhas, while Theravada is based on the historical Buddha. They each have commentarial velocities as a result of their prevailing foci, but they count as Buddhism each to this extent.

It simply shows that Buddhism is a very, very broad term, and that's without even talking about the Tibetan religions.
Yes I belive to see where you are comming from, but to me other Buddhas in historical time than Gotama Buddha, is purely imagination.

Therefore it is misleading to call religions following the teachings of imagined Buddhas, Buddhism - since that term rightly should be used only for the teachings of the historical one.

Specially when they are not in accordance with the teachings given by Gotama.

:anjali:
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Mr Man
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Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by Mr Man »

jan fessel wrote:
Yes a true follower of the Buddha follow the words of the Buddha, and not of his students.
So a monk should not follow the words of his preceptor?
plwk
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Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by plwk »

I think you have mixed up your qoutations Pwlk.
I have not commented on the Jewel ornament of liberation.
What has my reply to tiltbilings got to do with you?
Yes a true follower of the Buddha follow the words of the Buddha, and not of his students.
Right, we have heard your personal opinion and proclamation over and over again, the rinse and repeat cycle is unnecessary...
The Jivaka quote has to be understood in context, with other words spoken by the Buddha.
Of course, your selective context, I get it...
jan fessel
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Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by jan fessel »

mikenz66 wrote:
jan fessel wrote: Yes I partly agree, there are many things in Theravada buddhism, that should not be called buddhism.

However its my opinion that those in Theravada who follow the Suttas, specially the earliest nikayas - the core of the dhamma, is following the words of the Buddha and can therefore in a meaningful and true way be referred to, as Buddhist.
It is, of course, your choice to have your own definition of what is "Buddhist". However, just as a Theravada practitioner would not accept a Mahayana definition of their practice as "Hinayana", it's not up to you to define those who follow Mayahana teachings , Classical Theravada teachings, or a Secular Buddhist approach as "not Buddhist". And it would certainly be rash to assert that approaches that you have defined as "not teachings of the historical Buddha" do not lead to awakening.

By all means, express your preference for the teachings that you feel are the true Buddha-Vachana. However, please be mindful of the Terms of Service of our Forum:
Badmouthing of other spiritual paths is not allowed.
and
There are a broad spectrum of approaches to, and interpretations of, the Dhamma. Please refrain from wholesale dismissal of a particular view, approach, or teaching style.
:anjali:
Mike
I do in no way understand you Mike.

The Mahayana sutras and writings contains a lot of shameful denigration and derision of the early Buddhist teachings, which is an implicit, integrated and malicious part of the Mahayana view.

And then you tell me on a Theravada forum not to protest of that ?

Try to read the Lotus sutra for one, and see what kind of poison and propaganda Mahayana hold to be high wisdom.

:anjali:
jan fessel
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Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by jan fessel »

The Lotus Sutra is one of the earliest and most famous Mahayana texts and one might think that it is great wisdom, difficult to access.

However it appear on reading as a naive adventure story, where the authors intention that everyone should be able to understand Mahayanas superiority, is very thinly disguised.

Some of the Buddha's closest and most respected disciples, Kaccana, Kassapa and Moggallana, are here put words in their mouths, by Mahayana propaganda writers, so that they almost appear as senile fools:

"We are old, Master, and we are honored as an elder of the monastic congregation. Because we are old, we believe that we have reached nirvana, Master., We endeavor not to reach the sublime and highest enlightenment, because we do not measure or effort. when explaining teachings, Master, you sit long and talk. and when we sit and listen to your teaching, we get hurt in all limbs and joints from sitting so long. therefore we clearly see that all phenomena are empty , volatile and with no solid core. But we feel no longing for the Buddha's teachings, the different buddha countries or buddha 'and bodhisattvas game. and the reason for that is that when we fled from the world, we felt that we reached nirvana. Besides, we old and frail., even if we have guided and encouraged other bodhisattvas to reach the highest and perfect enlightenment, we have not even longed for it. "

The above mentioned fools is in original Buddhism Buddha's best students - Arahants - liberated, realized, beings - and here they are portrayed as senile fools, in order to make Mahayana look better.

The lotus sutra promise in the most primitive way, eternal damnation for those who do not appreciate this sutra, while Sutra supporters, are compared with jewels and precious stones.

At the same time the Lotus Sutra says that one should not read other sutras or books with worldly wisdom (since the good Mahayana aspirants offcourse could have second thoughts ....)

Here are some of this Sutras threats :


148.

Never think of other sutras

or books with worldly wisdom -

fit for fools. Avoid them and

preach this sutra instead



121.

Without feet, crawling on their bellies

they live consumed by parasites,

they suffer under cruel tortures

because they have rejected my sutra



122.

And when they finally are reborn as humans

they become dull, limp and hunchbacks

one-eyed, lame, pathetic and stupid:

since they do not believe in this sutra of mine!



It is clearly Mahayana propaganda of the worst kind.

Here is the Buddha Gotama,'s prediction about deception, just like this:

Samyutta Nikaya Sutta 20.7 reads: ...

"in the future, those Suttas uttered by the Tathagata, profound in their meaning, transcending the world, dealing with emptiness, for these, they will not listen, not to listen and do not want to understand, reciting or mastering. But teachings of poets, pure poetry, a conglomeration of words and phrases of people without knowledge of the doctrine, the utterances; these they will listen when spoken, will give ear to, want to understand recite and mastering.

:anjali:
jan fessel
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Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by jan fessel »

Here is a comment on another beautiful Mahayana creation - Hinayana.

The myth of Hinayana

Kare A. Lie

In the centuries around the birth of Christ there was a radical development
going on in Buddhism. A new school was born, and its adherents called it
Mahayana. How this new school differed from the earlier schools, can be
found in any history of Buddhism. Here we will concentrate on one of the
results of this schism: the term Hinayana.

The adherents of the older schools criticized the Mahayanists, especially
for creating new sutras, forging the word of the Buddha. The Mahayanists on
the other side reacted to that critique by accusing their opponents of not
understanding the teaching of the Buddha at all and for beeing narrowminded
egoists. The debate got heated, and accusations flowed from both sides. Then
some brilliant person at the Mahayana side of the debate created the word
pair Mahayana/Hinayana, and it stuck. They called their opponents Hinayana,
and this word worked excellently as an insult - with a simplicity and a
parallellity to Mahayana that any fool could grasp.

Hinayana, or, more correctly, hiinayaana, is a highly derogatory term. It
does not simply mean "Lesser vehicle" as one often can see stated. The
second element of hiina-yaana - that is yaana - means vehicle. But hiina
very seldom has the simple meaning of "lesser" or "small". If that had been
the case, the Pali (or Sanskrit) texts would have used it in other
connections as an opposite of mahaa - big. But they don't. The opposite of
mahaa is cuu.la, so this is the normal word for "small".

The term Hinayana is an echo of a debate long dead - or rather a debate
where the one party is dead and the other one is shouting to the winds.

Who were the opponents who were labeled Hinayana? Theravada? Probably not.
At the time when Mahayana was born, Theravada had mainly "emigrated" to Sri
Lanka, and could hardly be counted among the dominating schools on the
Indian mainland - where the Mahayana/Hinayana debate took place. The most
influential of the old schools at that time, was Sarvastivada, so they were
the most probable - but hardly the only - targets for the
"Hinayana"-invectives.

Now the Sarvastivada and the other early schools of India at that time are
long dead, except Theravada, but the debate and the arguments found their
way into the Mahayana sutras, as for instance is apparent from the
anti-Hinayana propaganda in the Lotus sutra - and keep echoing in the
Mahayana and Vajrayana teaching.

Today there is confusion, for the Mahayanists/Vajrayanists use the term
Hinayana in three different ways:

1) In the historical sense: Pre-Mahayanist schools are called Hinayana.
2) Modern Theravada is confused with Hinayana.
3) The term Hinayana is used for an internal part of the Mahayana/Vajrayana
teaching.

Let's have a closer look on these three usages.

1) Some assert that the word Hinayana as a term for the earlier schools is a
usage that belongs to the distant past only. This is not correct. It can be
found in several modern reference works, and in more specialist literature
it can for instance be found in H.V. Guenther, Buddhist Philosophy In Theory
and Practice, citing Tibetan works from the 18th and the 20th century.

2) As an example of confusing Hinayana with Theravada, I will quote from the
Bibliography of Jane Hope (Jane Hope studied with Chogyam Trungpa
Rinpoche.), Buddha for beginners, printed in 1995 (I only have the Norwegian
version available, so I hope my retranslation back into English will not be
too inaccurate): "Hinayana Buddhism. A good introduction to the traditional
Hinayana Buddhism is What the Buddha Taught, Walpola Rahula ... From a
present point of view and written by two Westerners trained in the Theravada
tradition, is ... Seeking the Heart of Wisdom, by Joseph Goldstein & Jack
Kornfield ..."

3) Now for a persistent confusion that has its basis in Tibetan Buddhism.
Some say that Hinayana and Mahayana from very early on are two terms used to
describe two different spiritual attitudes, and quote from the 7th chapter
("Loving Kindness and Compassion") of the Tibetan classic The Jewel Ornament
of Liberation written in the 10th century, where the author, Jé Gampopa
refers to Hinayana as "lower capacity" ("theg pa dman pa"). The paragraph
reads as follows: "'Clinging to the well-being of mere peace (1)' signifies
the lower capacity attitude (2) wherein the longing to transcend suffering
is focused on oneself alone. This precludes the cherishing of others and
hence there is little development of altruism. [...] When loving kindness
and compassion become part of one, there is so much care for other conscious
beings that one could not bear to liberate oneself alone. [...] Master
Manjushriikiirti has said: 'A Mahaayaana follower should not be without
loving kindness and compassion for even a single moment', and 'It is not
anger and hatred but loving kindness and compassion that vouchsafe the
welfare of others'."

The footnotes to this passage read as follows: (1) The Tibetan zhi.ba means
"peace". It is translated as "mere peace" in this section of the book, since
it is used by Gampopa to denote the relatively compassionless peace that
results from developing only concentration meditation. (2) Hinayana: "lesser
capacity" often translated as "lesser vehicle". The term implies the ability
to carry a burden. In this case the burden is oneself since one's commitment
is to bring oneself to liberation, not everyone (as is the case in the
Mahayana, the "greater capacity").

The problem and confusion here is of course that this analysis does not
refer directly to the Pali/Sanskrit word hiinayaana, but to its Tibetan
translation "theg pa dman pa". This is a key issue, as will be shown below.

The word Hinayana is not Tibetan, it is not Chinese, English or Bantu. It is
Pali and Sanskrit. Therefore, the only sensible approach for finding the
meaning of the word, is to study how the word hiinayaana is used in the Pali
and Sanskrit texts.

The second element, -yaana, means vehicle. There is no dissent about this.

How then is "hiina" used in the canonical Pali texts?

Every Buddhist knows the first recorded sermon of the Buddha, the
Dhammacakkappavattanasutta spoken to the five ascets who became the first
five bhikkhus. There the Buddha says: "These two extremes, monks, are not to
be practised by one who has gone forth from the world. What are the two?
That conjoined with the passions and luxury, low (hiina), coarse, vulgar,
ignoble and harmful ..."

Knowing that the sutta style often use strings of synonyms this way, so that
they strengthen and define each other, one can regard "coarse, vulgar,
ignoble and harmful" as auxiliary definitions of "hiina" in this case.

Here the Buddha clearly denotes the path not to be practised, as hiina.

In other Pali texts and commentaries hiina often occurs in the combination
hiina-majjhima-pa.niita, that is: bad - medium - good. In the context of
hiina - majjhima - pa.niita (or sometimes only hiina - pa.niita) the word
hiina is always used as a term for undesirable qualities, like for instance
hatred, greed and ignorance. It obviously means "low, undesirable,
despicable" - and not "small" or "lesser".

The commentary Mahaniddesa-atthakatha, one of the texts where this triad
occurs, defines the word thus: hiinattike hiinaati laamakaa (In the
hiina-triad "hiina" is "laamakaa"). Now laamaka is defined by the PTS
Dictionary in this way: "insignificant, poor, inferior, bad, sinful. The
usual synonym is paapa". And paapa means "bad, evil". So it seems the
definitions go from bad to worse here. The commentary then gives examples,
and explains that desires that cause rebirth in niraya (hell, purgatory) are
hiina.

Now for Sanskrit texts. In Lalitavistara we find a version of the
Dhammacakkappavattanasutta, where the word "hiina" is used exactly as in the
above citation from the Pali-version of that sutta.

In Mahayanasutralankara by Asanga, which is a very representativ Mahayana
text, we find something of interest for our quest. Asanga says: "There are
three groups of people: hiina-madhyama-vishishta ...(bad - medium -
excellent)." This expression is parallell to the Pali:
hiina-majjhima-pa.niita, and goes to show that the Mahayanists who coined
the therm "hiinayaana", regarded "hiina" as a derogatory term, with the same
meaning as in the Pali texts.

A very interesting text is an edition of the Catushparishatsutra where the
text is presented in four parallell columns: Sanskrit, Pali (Mahavagga),
Tibetan and a German translation from a Chinese version. Here, again, we
find the Dhammacakkappavattanasutta. We have already looked into the
Sanskrit and Pali. The German version from the Chinese says: "Erstens:
Gefallen zu finden an und anzunehmen die niedrigen und üblen Sitten der
gewöhnliche Personen ..." It is a little unclear wether it here is
"niedrigen" (despicable) or "üblen" (evil, bad) that corresponds to "hiina".
But it at least is clear that the strongly negative connotation of "hiina"
was carried over into the Chinese translation. So far nothing had changed
from the Pali and Sanskrit meanings.

In the the Tibetan column, we find that the Tibetan word "dman-pa" takes the
place corresponding to the Sanskrit "hiina", matching the above quote from
Jé Gampopa. And here we have the cause of later confusions and
misunderstandings of the term hiinayaana. Let us see what Tibetan-English
dictionaries say about "dman-pa": Sarat Chandra Das' Dictionary says:
"dman-pa: low, in reference to quantity or quality, little". Jäschke's
Dictionary is even more enlightening: "dman-pa: 1. low, in reference to
quantity, little. 2. in reference to quality: indifferent, inferior (Ssk:
hiina)."

It thus seems that the Sanskrit word hiina, which without any reasonable
doubt means "of low quality", came to be translated by the Tibetan word
dman-pa, which has the double meaning "low quality" and "low quantity". And
the above quote from Jé Gampopa seems to indicate that many Tibetans
henceforth read only the latter of those two meanings into it, as "lesser
capacity", "lower capacity", so that the meaning was distorted from "low
quality" to "low quantity".

Thus we see that the confusion arose from the fact that dman-pa has two
meanings in Tibetan. Hinayana - originally meaning "vehicle of despicable
quality" - thus acquired the new meaning "vehicle of lower capacity". But
this is a result of a wrong method. It is of course wrong to project the new
Tibetan meaning back onto the Sanskrit/Pali word, and say that "this is the
meaning of Hinayana, because this is how the Tibetan masters explain it."
What the Tibetan masters explain, is the Tibetan word dman-pa, not the
Sanskrit word hiina.

Therefore it is clear that one can not assert that Hinayana has the "mild"
meaning that the Tibetan tradition has given it, via the Tibetan word
dman-pa. Hinayana is not Tibetan, it is Sanskrit/Pali, and its harsh,
derogatory meaning is unchanged by any attempts of mitigation.

What then, is Hinayana? Is it Theravada buddhism? No, that is both insulting
and historically wrong. Is it a spiritual attitude inside the Mahayana and
Vajrayana system? No, that is the Tibetan "theg pa dman pa", the lower
capacity attitude, and not the Sanskrit Hinayana, "the inferior vehicle".
Therefore, there is no Hinayana. Hinayana is nothing but a myth, although a
confused and disruptive one, and wise Buddhists ought to lay that word at
rest on the shelves of the Museum of Schisms, where it rightly belongs, and
find other words to denote those spiritual attitudes that they wish to
define.

:anjali:
Last edited by jan fessel on Sat Sep 06, 2014 3:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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tiltbillings
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Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by tiltbillings »

The Lotus Sutra, a horrible text, was not a highly regarded text in Indian Mahayana. The term hinayana is highly problematic, and I list a bunch of other stuff. Nonetheless, there is Dhamma that can be easily found in the Mahayana.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
jan fessel
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Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by jan fessel »

tiltbillings wrote:The Lotus Sutra, a horrible text, was not a highly regarded text in Indian Mahayana. The term hinayana is highly problematic, and I list a bunch of other stuff. Nonetheless, there is Dhamma that can be easily found in the Mahayana.
I agree with you that true dhamma can be found in Mahayana.

But if one is new in mahayana it can often only be found after long time, or with great difficulty.

:anjali:
daverupa
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Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by daverupa »

Let's try to keep the OP in mind, gentle forum goers.

:focus:
  • "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.

- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]
jan fessel
Posts: 68
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2010 12:24 am

Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by jan fessel »

This post has now been deleted two time.

Why dont Dhammawheel admins tell me in words, if they desire to sensor me ?

:thinking:

Here goes some more lovely Mahayana "Buddhism".

According to Mahayana, it is possible and acceptable to kill people like me or Brian Ruhe, who openly criticize the Mahayana Sutras, and it will not create bad karma for the killer.

Excerpt from the Mahaparinivana Sutra Chapter 22 :

"The Buddha : One may well kill an ant and gain the sin of harming, but the killing of an Icchantika does not [constitute a sin]."

Who are these Icchantikas where killing them does not incur any karmic returns?

The Buddha said : A monk, nun, male or female lay disciple may be one.
One who having rejected the scriptures with unpleasant speech and does not, subsequently, even ask for forgiveness has entered into the path of the Icchantika."

Chapter 22 of the Mahayana Mahaparinirvana Sutra states:

O good man! The Buddha and Bodhisattva see three categories of killing, which are those of the grades 1) low, 2) medium, and 3) high. Low applies to the class of insects and all kinds of animals, except for the transformation body of the Bodhisattva who may present himself as such. O good man! The Bodhisattva-mahasattva, through his vows and in certain circumstances, gets born as an animal. This is killing beings of the lowest class. By reason of harming life of the lowest grade, one gains life in the realms of hell, animals or hungry ghosts and suffers from the down most “duhkha” [pain, mental or physical]. Why so? Because these animals have done somewhat of good. Hence, one who harms them receives full karmic returns for his actions. This is killing of the lowest grade. The medium grade of killing concerns killing [beings] from the category of humans up to the class of anagamins. This is middle-grade killing. As a result, one gets born in the realms of hell, animals or hungry ghosts and fully receives the karmic consequences befitting the middle grade of suffering. This is medium-grade killing. Top-rank killing relates to killing one’s father or mother, an arhat, pratyekabudda, or a Bodhisattva of the last established state. This is top-rank killing. In consequence of this, one falls into the greatest Avichi Hell [the most terrible of all the hells] and endures the karmic consequences befitting the highest level of suffering. This is top-grade killing.


O good man! A person who kills an Icchantika does not suffer from the karmic returns due to the killings of the three kinds named above. O good man! All those Brahmins are of the class of the Icchantika. For example, such actions as digging the ground, mowing the grass, felling trees, cutting up corpses, ill-speaking, and lashing do not call forth karmic returns. Killing an icchantika comes within the same category. No karmic results ensue. Why not? Because no Brahmins and no five laws to begin with faith, etc. are involved here [Maybe: no Brahmins are concerned with the "five roots" of faith, vigour, mindfulness, concentration, and Wisdom]. For this reason, killing [of this kind] does not carry one off to hell.

Again in Chapter 40 of the same Sutra it is stated; "O good man! Because the Icchantikas are cut off from the root of good. All beings possess such five roots as faith, etc. But the people of the Icchantika class are eternally cut off from such. Because of this, one may well kill an ant and gain the sin of harming, but the killing of an Icchantika does not [constitute a sin]."

"O World-Honoured One! The icchantika possesses nothing that is good. Is it for this reason that such a person is called an "Icchantika"?
The Buddha said: "It is so, it is so!"
Who are these Icchantikas where killing them does not incur any karmic returns?
[The Buddha] said: A monk, nun, male or female lay disciple may be one. One who having rejected the scriptures with unpleasant speech and does not, subsequently, even ask for forgiveness has entered into the path of the Icchantika. Those who have committed the four parajikas and those who have committed the five sins of immediate retribution, who even if they are aware that they have entered into a fearful place do not perceive it as fearful, who do not attach themselves to the side of the true teachings and without making any efforts at all think ‘‘let’s get rid of the true teachings,’’ who proclaim even that that very [teaching] is blame-worthy - they too have entered into the path of the Icchantika. Those who claim ‘‘There is no Buddha, there is no teaching, there is no monastic community’’ are also said to have entered the path of the Icchantika.
:thinking:

After reading the above examples from Mahayana it's my hope that you now understand why I can only give my respect to Brian Ruhe, for bravely rejecting Mahayana teachings as being true buddhism.

In doing so he has done a honourable thing and broadly told the truth, even his style and a few strange ideas of his about other things than buddhism, may not be pleasing to the sensitive gentlemen on a buddhist forum of today.

:anjali:
daverupa
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Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2011 6:58 pm

Re: Brian Ruhe and Representation

Post by daverupa »

jan fessel wrote:This post has now been deleted two time.

Why dont Dhammawheel admins tell me in words, if they desire to sensor me ?
:sigh:

It isn't censorship; you already expressed your appreciation a few posts ago, so this recent effort seems like an excuse for a continuing diatribe, especially since it's one of the only threads you post in and this time after almost a month.

This meta-discussion is also off-topic, so let us get back the regularly scheduled conversation (that had been stopped for quite a while), but on-topic and absent such wee rants as above...
  • "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.

- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]
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