seanpdx wrote:meindzai wrote:
Such questions lead to a thicket of views because they are the wrong question. They are inappropriate, they do not lead to awakening.
Why? How?
The reason those questions lead to suffering is because they assume existence or non-existence. But those questions arise due to one's own attention, and are bound to cease. So assuming existence or non-existence involves holding to something that arises and passes away - thereby subjecting oneself to stress that is unnecessary.
SN 12.15: Kaccāyanagottasutta
"By & large, Kaccayana, this world is supported by (takes as its object) a polarity, that of existence & non-existence. But when one sees the origination of the world as it actually is with right discernment, 'non-existence' with reference to the world does not occur to one. When one sees the cessation of the world as it actually is with right discernment, 'existence' with reference to the world does not occur to one.
"By & large, Kaccayana, this world is in bondage to attachments, clingings (sustenances), & biases. But one such as this does not get involved with or cling to these attachments, clingings, fixations of awareness, biases, or obsessions; nor is he resolved on 'my self.' He has no uncertainty or doubt that just stress, when arising, is arising; stress, when passing away, is passing away. In this, his knowledge is independent of others. It's to this extent, Kaccayana, that there is right view.
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Seeing this clearly is what involves the attainment of Stream-Entry (Sotāpanna):
Mv 1.23.1-10: Upatissa-pasine
"Whatever phenomena arise from cause: their cause and their cessation. Such is the teaching of the Tathagata, the Great Contemplative."
Then to Sariputta the Wanderer, as he heard this Dhamma exposition, there arose the dustless, stainless Dhamma eye: Whatever is subject to origination is all subject to cessation.
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And about your question before, I quote the suttas because they are very clear and much more of an authority than me. We're not trying to make our own Dhamma here. If you find something in the suttas unclear, feel free to bring it up.
vinasp wrote:A belief in rebirth was expected of those on the wrong path. Since they had a "view of self" they would not ask "What is reborn?", for them, it was obvious.
This statement has no basis in the Canon as shown above by the Tiṃsamattasutta quote. It also implies that the Buddha lied just to get people to practice.