500,000 upasika ordination in Thailand. Real ordination?

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
Brizzy

Re: 500,000 upasika ordination in Thailand. Real ordination?

Postby Brizzy » Sun Apr 04, 2010 9:44 am

cooran wrote:Worth bearing in mind when we minimise the lowering of standards for Bhikkhus from the level the Buddha taught:

'Anagatavamsa' " The Sermon of the Chronicle to be "
""'How will it occur? After my decease there will first be five disappearances. What five? The disappearance of attainment (in the Dispensation), the disappearance of proper conduct, the disappearance of learning, the disappearance of the outward form, the disappearance
of the relics. There will be these five disappearances.
................................................................................................

'This, Sariputta, is called the disappearance of the outward form. """

A short time indeed does the Buddha's sasana last.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dhammastu ... sage/24257

with metta
Chris


Hi cooran

Not that I dont agree with you about a monks vinaya being of extreme importance, I think this "Apocryphal" work you cited does not lend credence to your argument. A "thousand years"? Where does this come from? are there no longer people who can gain attainments? It sounds almost mahayana in its reading.

:smile:

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BlackBird
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Re: 500,000 upasika ordination in Thailand. Real ordination?

Postby BlackBird » Sun Apr 04, 2010 10:22 am

Does anyone know anything about the origins of this 'Anagatavamsa'? Doesn't seem like Buddhavacana to me.

All I can really find is this short synopsis:

This Sinhala recension of the Anagatavamsa, here translated into English for the first time, is but one of several texts forming a genre of Buddhist apocalyptic literature generated by the cult of Maitreya in South and Southeast Asia. It is a prophetic text revealing a rich religious imagination focused upon the advent of the future Buddha in a time when those who have long persevered in the religious quest will gain an opportunity to realize the highest spiritual attainment.

- http://www.exoticindiaart.com/book/details/IDC071/

metta
Jack
"For a disciple who has conviction in the Teacher's message & lives to penetrate it, what accords with the Dhamma is this:
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." - MN. 70 Kitagiri Sutta

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gavesako
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Re: 500,000 upasika ordination in Thailand. Real ordination?

Postby gavesako » Sun Apr 04, 2010 3:44 pm

Such millenial references are found even earlier, for example in the later parts of the Theragatha in the verses of Parapariya. He speaks of the "final age" (pacchima-kala) in which the Dhamma disappears and urges a return to the forest:

http://books.google.com/books?id=0TMsdV ... ya&f=false
Bhikkhu Gavesako
Kiṃkusalagavesī anuttaraṃ santivarapadaṃ pariyesamāno... (MN 26)

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Cittasanto
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Re: 500,000 upasika ordination in Thailand. Real ordination?

Postby Cittasanto » Sun Apr 04, 2010 7:08 pm

BlackBird wrote:Does anyone know anything about the origins of this 'Anagatavamsa'? Doesn't seem like Buddhavacana to me.

All I can really find is this short synopsis:

This Sinhala recension of the Anagatavamsa, here translated into English for the first time, is but one of several texts forming a genre of Buddhist apocalyptic literature generated by the cult of Maitreya in South and Southeast Asia. It is a prophetic text revealing a rich religious imagination focused upon the advent of the future Buddha in a time when those who have long persevered in the religious quest will gain an opportunity to realize the highest spiritual attainment.

- http://www.exoticindiaart.com/book/details/IDC071/

metta
Jack

Hi Jack,
to link to the post above yours as well, I watched a program a couple of years ago about the Buddhist artefacts in the British Museum from Sri Lanka, and it was mentioned that Sri Lanka was at one time predominantly Mahayana, or Mahasangha (it was a couple of years ago) so this may of infuluenced this text?
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill

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Re: 500,000 upasika ordination in Thailand. Real ordination?

Postby tiltbillings » Sun Apr 04, 2010 11:33 pm

BlackBird wrote:Does anyone know anything about the origins of this 'Anagatavamsa'? Doesn't seem like Buddhavacana to me.

All I can really find is this short synopsis:

This Sinhala recension of the Anagatavamsa, here translated into English for the first time, is but one of several texts forming a genre of Buddhist apocalyptic literature generated by the cult of Maitreya in South and Southeast Asia. It is a prophetic text revealing a rich religious imagination focused upon the advent of the future Buddha in a time when those who have long persevered in the religious quest will gain an opportunity to realize the highest spiritual attainment.

- http://www.exoticindiaart.com/book/details/IDC071/

metta
Jack

It is dated to the 14th cent CE, and it pull together a lot of late stuff not found in the suttas and obviously has a Mahayana in influence.
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

      >> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<<
      -- Proverbs 26:12

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BlackBird
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Re: 500,000 upasika ordination in Thailand. Real ordination?

Postby BlackBird » Mon Apr 05, 2010 7:39 am

Cheers guys

metta
Jack
"For a disciple who has conviction in the Teacher's message & lives to penetrate it, what accords with the Dhamma is this:
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." - MN. 70 Kitagiri Sutta


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