Arahants

An open and inclusive investigation into Buddhism and spiritual cultivation

Arahants

Postby unspoken » Thu Feb 17, 2011 10:06 am

Sorry I need to post a question on arahant. So I was arguing with my friend which he claims that now in the present world, there would be thousands of arahants and most of them do not exactly needed to be a buddhist. So I strongly disagree with him and told him that arahant is the enlighten ones and also if were to be arahant, to reach nibanna they must at least acquired the minimum of the 4th jhana and had gone through the stages of purification, stream-entry, once returner, non-returner only able to reach arahant. And by means of those stages, only vipasana meditation in buddhism is available to achieve the practice of full mindfulness. So by saying those it shut him up but still he don't believe in what I said. Can anyone tell me, am I saying the truth?
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Re: Arahants

Postby A_Martin » Thu Feb 17, 2011 10:48 am

well this is not easy to answer, partially true, partially not completely right. There are only a few Arahants, whatever few is, they are difficult to find, for they normally do not advertise them as being such. There can be non Buddhists, one exception I am pretty sure of was Meister Eckhart and he was a Christian. It is not the religion that brings about Arahantship, but it is following the path of sila, samadhi and panna. And as a prerequisite the virtues of generosity, respect and gratitude. So anyone, in whatever religion is following this path might attain to one of the ariya stages. You don't need the fourth jhana, but you do need the skills of diving into the state of deep samadhi, where all the five khandhas will rest to work for the time being.
My general motto is let the people believe what they believe, you cannot change their minds, but you can change your own mind.
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Re: Arahants

Postby unspoken » Thu Feb 17, 2011 2:40 pm

But doesn't to get into the 4 ariya stages. We would only able to do so if we are in mindfulness? To be meditate only to achieve it? The continuous mindfulness?
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Re: Arahants

Postby fabianfred » Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:01 pm

Mindfulness= Vipassana ...this technique is only taught by Buddhas, so when there are no Buddhas or their teachings about the Four Foundations of Mindfulness then there can be no crossing over from Putuchon to Ariiyachon by reaching the state of Stream-entry.
Stream-entry is naturally followed by Arahant and Nibbana in no more than seven lives after reaching stream-entry.
Arahants who have practiced concentration meditation MAY have achieved the 4th jhana and have got some of the special powers which can be attained.
Those who have achieved the 4th Jhana are not necessarily Arahants if they have not practiced Vipassana.
During the times when there are no Buddhas and their teachings only concentration meditation is practiced so no chance to reach Nibbana.......if one could reach stream-entry by concentration meditation alone then there would be no need for Buddhas.
Achieving Jhanas is not essential to reaching stream-entry.
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Re: Arahants

Postby unspoken » Fri Feb 18, 2011 6:57 am

I must point out that the Buddha was also an Arahant. Pacceka Buddha is also an Arahant. A disciple can also be an Arahant.


The above line is by Ven. Dr. W. Rahula.

What does it meant? Isn't Arahant is one who reached Nibbana, enlightened and only through the help of the Buddha's doctrine?
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Re: Arahants

Postby fabianfred » Fri Feb 18, 2011 1:44 pm

Arahants have attained to Nibbana after following the teachings of a Sammasabuddha.
Both Sammasambuddha and Pacekhabuddhas attain to Arahant in the same moment they are rid of the defilements but then progress from there as knowledge comes to them.
Arahant means one free from all defilements.
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Re: Arahants

Postby unspoken » Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:09 pm

Confusion had been ceased. Sadhu!
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Re: Arahants

Postby Sambodhi in Oz » Fri Feb 18, 2011 4:37 pm

The Arhat does not really belong to any religion, even Buddha never propogated any religion, he only taught Dhamma he never taught Baudha Dhamma, in entire tipitika you cannot find a single word 'bauddha'. He never asked anybody to say 'Baudha dhammam saranam gachchami' he said ' dhamma saranam gachchami'.

And anybody belonging (so to say) to any religion if follows the eight fold path in letter and spirit will reach the end irrespective of the caste / creed / religion he so to say belongs to.

What is most important is following the path Vipassana leads to.

Metta

Parth :namaste:
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