the great vegetarian debate

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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retrofuturist
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Re: the great vegetarian debate

Post by retrofuturist »

Greetings,
mikenz66 wrote:The DFFA is a place where essentially all views of some relevance to the Dhamma can be discussed.
Yes... views need not dismissed as adhammic, merely for being heterodox.

Taking it upon ourselves to define what's dhammic vs what's adhammic? I think we know where that leads... :spy:

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
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DNS
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Re: the great vegetarian debate

Post by DNS »

retrofuturist wrote: Yes... views need not dismissed as adhammic, merely for being heterodox.

Taking it upon ourselves to define what's dhammic vs what's adhammic? I think we know where that leads... :spy:
Also, determining what is heterodox and not heterodox, like dhammic and a-dhammic, is also an opinion and view.

From one of Ashoka's edicts:

"Formerly, in the kitchen of Beloved-of-the-Gods, King Piyadas [Ashoka], hundreds of
thousands of animals were killed every day to make curry. But now with the writing of this
Dhamma edict only three creatures, two peacocks and a deer are killed, and the deer not
always. And in time, not even these three creatures will be killed
."
(Gujarat, India)

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... el386.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Ben
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Re: the great vegetarian debate

Post by Ben »

Lets consider for a moment, that right now in the Horn of Africa, millions of people are facing starvation.
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

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Lazy_eye
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Re: the great vegetarian debate

Post by Lazy_eye »

Ben wrote:Lets consider for a moment, that right now in the Horn of Africa, millions of people are facing starvation.
And I can help them by frying up some steaks? How does meat consumption in affluent Western countries relieve global poverty? :thinking:
daverupa
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Re: the great vegetarian debate

Post by daverupa »

Lazy_eye wrote:
Ben wrote:Lets consider for a moment, that right now in the Horn of Africa, millions of people are facing starvation.
And I can help them by frying up some steaks? How does meat consumption in affluent Western countries relieve global poverty? :thinking:
Thusly.
  • "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.

- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]
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Ben
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Re: the great vegetarian debate

Post by Ben »

It doesn't.
It was to give some people pause for thought to stop thinking about themselves and their preoccupation with what they put in their mouths (and those of others) and perhaps avert their attention to those who have nothing are fleeing famine, disease, lions and militia and are starving.
73577336_f51d0f7df8_o.jpg
73577336_f51d0f7df8_o.jpg (69.52 KiB) Viewed 2038 times
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR

e: [email protected]..
alan
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the great vegetarian debate

Post by alan »

I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news, friends, but I must inform you that Soy is not healthful. Along with all the chemicals included in the ingredients of a typical veggie burger we find the insidious "yeast extract." Also known as MSG, a neurotoxin. Those "natural flavors" may be "non--meat", but what are they? Do you trust them to tell you the truth?
I get the veggie impulse. I respect it. But please be aware that food corporations exist to make money, and they will make it anyway they can. Exploiting the feelings of vegetarians is one way they do it. It is up to you to know these things. Don't be fooled!
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tiltbillings
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the great vegetarian debate

Post by tiltbillings »

alan wrote:I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news, friends, but I must inform you that Soy is not healthful. Along with all the chemicals included in the ingredients of a typical veggie burger we find the insidious "yeast extract." Also known as MSG, a neurotoxin. Those "natural flavors" may be "non--meat", but what are they? Do you trust them to tell you the truth?
I get the veggie impulse. I respect it. But please be aware that food corporations exist to make money, and they will make it anyway they can. Exploiting the feelings of vegetarians is one way they do it. It is up to you to know these things. Don't be fooled!
Probably still a lot safer than eating the usually raised and slaughtered cow.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
alan
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the great vegetarian debate

Post by alan »

Organic, free range animal meat is probably more healthful.
alan
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the great vegetarian debate

Post by alan »

I'm also concerned with the lack of healthy fats in the vegetarian diet.
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tiltbillings
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the great vegetarian debate

Post by tiltbillings »

alan wrote:I'm also concerned with the lack of healthy fats in the vegetarian diet.
I am not.
alan wrote:Organic, free range animal meat is probably more healthful.
One of my co-workers raises cattle, free range, grass fed, etc., so when the round of slaughtering is due, you can come here and kill one. I am sure they give you a discount for doing that work..
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
Reductor
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the great vegetarian debate

Post by Reductor »

Hey alan. I used to work in a feed mill. I haven't looked at steak the same way since. But being in the far north all cows here spend months eating man made feed, otherwise they die. The feed is heavy of husks from wheat and barley, and many many kilos of medication. We would put hundreds of pounds into their feed. Much of it was to prevent swelling of their digestive tracks from their rich diets, which would normally cause death.

And they were the least drugged of tye bunch. Don't get me started on pork. Gawd.

None of those drugs are listed on the animal product I have ever seen.

Sneaky food corporations indeed.
alan
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the great vegetarian debate

Post by alan »

No doubt that cattle are raised in horrible conditions. That is one reason why I don't consume beef.
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the great vegetarian debate

Post by alan »

Vegetarianism has devolved into a simple-minded cult that refuses to accept new dietary science. Don't be like that.
We now know that some fats are good. You should eat them.
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tiltbillings
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the great vegetarian debate

Post by tiltbillings »

alan wrote:Vegetarianism has devolved into a simple-minded cult that refuses to accept new dietary science. Don't be like that.
We now know that some fats are good. You should eat them.
Damdifino what you are talking about. "New dietary science?" Must have come out yesterday. Nothing I have seen in any reputable dietary science before yesterday that says a vegie diet cannot be balanced and healthy and that vegie fats cannot meet the various omega and other such requirements.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
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