Vinaya & sutta

A forum for members who wish to develop a deeper understanding of the Pali Canon and associated Commentaries, which for discussion purposes are both treated as authoritative.

Moderator: Mahavihara moderator

User avatar
Cittasanto
Posts: 5876
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:31 pm
Which number is larger than 1000 and less than 1002: 1
Location: Ellan Vannin
Contact:

Vinaya & sutta

Postby Cittasanto » Thu May 14, 2009 10:27 am

one for those who have read the whole of the vinaya and Bhikkhu's

I havent read the whole of the vinaya exept the rules which can be found on A2I & other places and a while ago wondered this when I read one of the books found on a link in another section here but didn't ask, now I have the same question, are the sections in the Khandhaka of the Vinaya (Cullavagga & Mahavagga) the same as those found in the sutta Nipata?
This offering maybe right, or wrong, but it is one, the other, both, or neither!
Blog, - Some Suttas Translated, Ajahn Chah.
"Others will misconstrue reality due to their personal perspectives, doggedly holding onto and not easily discarding them; We shall not misconstrue reality due to our own personal perspectives, nor doggedly holding onto them, but will discard them easily. This effacement shall be done."

User avatar
Dhammanando
Posts: 1438
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:44 pm
Which number is larger than 1000 and less than 1002: 1001
Location: Wat Doi Phra Koed, Chom Thong, Chiang Mai

Re: Vinaya & sutta

Postby Dhammanando » Thu May 14, 2009 12:25 pm

Manapa wrote:now I have the same question, are the sections in the Khandhaka of the Vinaya (Cullavagga & Mahavagga) the same as those found in the sutta Nipata?


No, they just happen to share the same names. The names mean, respectively, Greater Section and Lesser Section, so it’s no surprise that they crop up in different collections.

As well as the Vinaya and Suttanipata, there are also Cullavaggas in the Anguttara Nikaya, the Udana and the Petavatthu. There are Mahavaggas in all the first four Nikayas, and about half a dozen books from the Khuddaka Nikaya.

Best wishes,
Dhammanando Bhikkhu
    ...and this thought arose in the mind of the Blessed One:
    “Who lives without reverence lives miserably.”
    Uruvela Sutta, A.ii.20

    It were endless to dispute upon everything that is disputable.
    — William Penn Some Fruits of Solitude,

User avatar
Cittasanto
Posts: 5876
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:31 pm
Which number is larger than 1000 and less than 1002: 1
Location: Ellan Vannin
Contact:

Re: Vinaya & sutta

Postby Cittasanto » Fri May 15, 2009 4:58 am

Thank-you Bhante,
the initial reason was because I was flicking through one of the online book in the link (world libry I think?) and one of the "Suttas" there were in another collection with a different designation ie. instead of MN 12 it was CV9 so I was a bit confused about that, I had noticed a difference in spelling of Cullavagga (Culavagga) on The Wikipitaka site in the vinaya section and on Access to insight on the Suttanipata section, but forgot about the Q, do you know if there is a good online version of the parts of the vinaya not covered on A2I? or is there a with these sections and the summary easily available?
This offering maybe right, or wrong, but it is one, the other, both, or neither!
Blog, - Some Suttas Translated, Ajahn Chah.
"Others will misconstrue reality due to their personal perspectives, doggedly holding onto and not easily discarding them; We shall not misconstrue reality due to our own personal perspectives, nor doggedly holding onto them, but will discard them easily. This effacement shall be done."

User avatar
Dhammanando
Posts: 1438
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:44 pm
Which number is larger than 1000 and less than 1002: 1001
Location: Wat Doi Phra Koed, Chom Thong, Chiang Mai

Re: Vinaya & sutta

Postby Dhammanando » Fri May 15, 2009 6:23 pm

Hi Manapa,

Manapa wrote:do you know if there is a good online version of the parts of the vinaya not covered on A2I?


Apart from the bhikkhuni-patimokkha I don't think there is very much that's not covered in the two volumes of Ven. Thanissaro's Buddhist Monastic Code. The first volume covers all of the bhikkhu-patimokkha, while the second covers the extra-patimokkha rules and descriptions of procedural matters preserved in the Khandhakas (i.e. the Mahavagga and Cullavagga). I'm not sure if it it covers all of the Khandhaka material, but I get the impression the author has at least covered everything that the average bhikkhu is ever likely to encounter in practice.

There is a homepage somewhere dedicated to collecting online materials on Vinaya. It's owned by the Malaysian monk Ven. Kumara, so you might be able to find it with Google. Also there's an online edition of Hermann Oldenburg's translation of the Vinaya Pitaka.

Best wishes,
Dhammanando Bhikkhu
    ...and this thought arose in the mind of the Blessed One:
    “Who lives without reverence lives miserably.”
    Uruvela Sutta, A.ii.20

    It were endless to dispute upon everything that is disputable.
    — William Penn Some Fruits of Solitude,

User avatar
Cittasanto
Posts: 5876
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:31 pm
Which number is larger than 1000 and less than 1002: 1
Location: Ellan Vannin
Contact:

Re: Vinaya & sutta

Postby Cittasanto » Sat May 16, 2009 3:49 pm

I have not had too much interest in the second volume as it was more like a look at why volume ones content existed, instead of a look through the other parts of the vinaya and how the rules are followed, although I have refered to it on occasion when I looked therough volume one and a rule seamed nit picky or strange (if that could be the correct word/s) in a western use.

I have his vinaya site saved in my bookmarks just went to check it was the same site and there is a wiki open now which looks like it will be taking over from the evinaya site http://www.editthis.info/wikivinaya/Main_Page I have seen this book on a link I mentioned earlier, http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=vinaya ifound the search engine and books quite hard to look through as I found them quite unclear as to the content and this site was responsible for the initial wondering! allong with Khuddakapatha which seams to me more suited to the Vinaya section than the sutta section, and I thing is covered in volume 2.
This offering maybe right, or wrong, but it is one, the other, both, or neither!
Blog, - Some Suttas Translated, Ajahn Chah.
"Others will misconstrue reality due to their personal perspectives, doggedly holding onto and not easily discarding them; We shall not misconstrue reality due to our own personal perspectives, nor doggedly holding onto them, but will discard them easily. This effacement shall be done."

User avatar
Dhammanando
Posts: 1438
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:44 pm
Which number is larger than 1000 and less than 1002: 1001
Location: Wat Doi Phra Koed, Chom Thong, Chiang Mai

Re: Vinaya & sutta

Postby Dhammanando » Sat May 16, 2009 11:35 pm

Manapa wrote:along with Khuddakapatha which seams to me more suited to the Vinaya section than the sutta section, and I thing is covered in volume 2.


I'm not sure what you mean by this. The Khuddakapatha is a tiny collection of suttas in the Khuddaka Nikāya. It has nothing to do with Vinaya. Are you perhaps thinking of the "lesser and minor rules of training" (khuddānukhuddaka-sikkhāpada)?

Best wishes,
Dhammanando Bhikkhu
    ...and this thought arose in the mind of the Blessed One:
    “Who lives without reverence lives miserably.”
    Uruvela Sutta, A.ii.20

    It were endless to dispute upon everything that is disputable.
    — William Penn Some Fruits of Solitude,

User avatar
Cittasanto
Posts: 5876
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:31 pm
Which number is larger than 1000 and less than 1002: 1
Location: Ellan Vannin
Contact:

Re: Vinaya & sutta

Postby Cittasanto » Sun May 17, 2009 4:23 pm

Had myself wondering about that line then... hehe

Khuddakapatha on A2I looks to me more like the novice ordination section of Thanisaros volume 2 buddhist monastic code, than the average sections of the Khunddaka Nikaya, which added to my initial thought that the other sections of the Vinaya were from the sutta

Dhammanando wrote:
Manapa wrote:along with Khuddakapatha which seams to me more suited to the Vinaya section than the sutta section, and I thing is covered in volume 2.


I'm not sure what you mean by this. The Khuddakapatha is a tiny collection of suttas in the Khuddaka Nikāya. It has nothing to do with Vinaya. Are you perhaps thinking of the "lesser and minor rules of training" (khuddānukhuddaka-sikkhāpada)?

Best wishes,
Dhammanando Bhikkhu
This offering maybe right, or wrong, but it is one, the other, both, or neither!
Blog, - Some Suttas Translated, Ajahn Chah.
"Others will misconstrue reality due to their personal perspectives, doggedly holding onto and not easily discarding them; We shall not misconstrue reality due to our own personal perspectives, nor doggedly holding onto them, but will discard them easily. This effacement shall be done."


Return to “Classical Theravāda”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests