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Info on turner, apprentice and craft? - Dhamma Wheel

Info on turner, apprentice and craft?

A forum for members who wish to develop a deeper understanding of the Pali Canon and associated Commentaries, which for discussion purposes are both treated as authoritative.

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lojong1
Posts: 580
Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2009 2:59 am

Info on turner, apprentice and craft?

Postby lojong1 » Wed Feb 13, 2013 11:55 pm

Why have I been picturing a blade guided across wood turning on a lathe, with a turn being one pass across?

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James the Giant
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Re: Info on turner, apprentice and craft?

Postby James the Giant » Thu Feb 14, 2013 1:29 am

It's a famous simile from the Satipatthana Sutta. Or the Mahasatipatthana sutta
Then,
saturated with joy,
you will put an end to suffering and stress.

lojong1
Posts: 580
Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2009 2:59 am

Re: Info on turner, apprentice and craft?

Postby lojong1 » Thu Feb 14, 2013 5:35 am

Yes, I'm wanting to hear more about the practice of 'turning' as it was back in the day.

Virgo
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Re: Info on turner, apprentice and craft?

Postby Virgo » Thu Feb 14, 2013 6:42 am



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Cittasanto
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Re: Info on turner, apprentice and craft?

Postby Cittasanto » Thu Feb 14, 2013 6:50 am



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

lojong1
Posts: 580
Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2009 2:59 am

Re: Info on turner, apprentice and craft?

Postby lojong1 » Sun Feb 17, 2013 1:02 am

TY!
Can folks explain in detail how they relate this turning to the breath? Given the perfection of so many other of buddha's similes, doesn't this one look a little misunderstood or just plain shite? Why would you ever make the wood turn slowly?

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Sam Vara
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Re: Info on turner, apprentice and craft?

Postby Sam Vara » Sun Feb 17, 2013 6:48 pm


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Cittasanto
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Re: Info on turner, apprentice and craft?

Postby Cittasanto » Sun Feb 17, 2013 10:20 pm



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

lojong1
Posts: 580
Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2009 2:59 am

Re: Info on turner, apprentice and craft?

Postby lojong1 » Mon Feb 18, 2013 6:45 pm

Short turn, yes, not slow.
Early last year Daverupa quotes : "One will also notice that certain passages are not found elsewhere in the Pāli—for example, the simile where a yogi sensing each breathflow’s length is compared to a turner who knows the duration of each pass [of the blade?] on the lathe."
This is still the only way I can make sense of the lathe image, so is this possible based on the pali? Is there still uncertainty about it's meaning? Virgo says potter's wheel!
This won't worry or hold me back too long; it's just the burning question of the day.

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Cittasanto
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Re: Info on turner, apprentice and craft?

Postby Cittasanto » Mon Feb 18, 2013 8:26 pm



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

lojong1
Posts: 580
Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2009 2:59 am

Re: Info on turner, apprentice and craft?

Postby lojong1 » Mon Feb 18, 2013 10:04 pm


lojong1
Posts: 580
Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2009 2:59 am

Re: Info on turner, apprentice and craft?

Postby lojong1 » Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:03 pm



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