Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby zamis » Mon Jan 05, 2009 7:03 pm

Thank you also, Bhante. It was delightful to read that this was a collection of sayings by Paccekabuddhas. I'm one of many with affinity to this particular Sutta. Along the lines of Ben's question regarding the Sangha, it mentions in two places to shed the household marks. How is this understood? Did these contemplatives leave the household life and don ochre robes though there was no sangha to join? Were ochre robes worn by others before the Buddha's first sangha?
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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby Dhammanando » Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:52 pm

Hi Ben,

Ben wrote:Also, I was interested to note that the Isigili Sutta is regarded as a paritta. If you don't mind me asking, in what way does the Isigili Sutta offer protection?


I don’t know. In Thailand one occasionally finds the sutta included in books of parittas, but I’ve never witnessed any ceremony in which it was chanted or read any instructions as to what it is for.

The sutta's use as a paritta in Sri Lanka seems to go back a long way, for it’s one of eight parittas listed in the Anguttara Commentary (Āṭānāṭiyaparitta, Isigiliparitta, Dhajaggaparitta, Bojjhaṅgaparitta, Khandhaparitta, Moraparitta, Mettaparitta, Ratanaparitta) whose efficacy extends throughout the ten thousandfold world sphere. But unlike with other parittas, the commentary to the Isigilisutta doesn't say anything about the sutta's origin that would furnish any clue

Best wishes,
Dhammanando Bhikkhu
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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby Dhammanando » Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:21 pm

Hi Dhammakid,

Dhammakid wrote:Also, a question: If, when there is no Dhamma dispensation in the world, one becomes a paccekabuddha, will others in the world know about this monumental event? Or are solitary buddhas destined to anonymity until a future sammasambuddha comes along and recognizes them?


Right. In the human realm they may be respected by some as virtuous ascetics, but it seems that their status as incomparable fields of merit goes by and large unremarked. The commentaries have quite a few stories about people ending up in hell for mistreating paccekabuddhas, or as hungry ghosts for being niggardly towards them, not realizing the enormity of what they're doing. On the other hand, there are stories of people ending up spending aeons in heavenly realms just for giving a paccekabuddha a spoonful of rice.

What practice leads one to paccekabuddha-hood if you don't have the Dhamma to guide you? Just meditation? Do the suttas say anything about this?


In the Sutta Piṭaka the only source is the Cullaniddesa's detailed exposition of the Khaggavisāṇa Sutta. Other than that one has to go to the commentaries. As for a paccekabuddha's practice, this will be covered in the Manop article.

Best wishes,
Dhammanando Bhikkhu
    ...and this thought arose in the mind of the Blessed One:
    “Who lives without reverence lives miserably.”
    Uruvela Sutta, A.ii.20

    It were endless to dispute upon everything that is disputable.
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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby Dhammakid » Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:47 pm

Dhammanando wrote:Right. In the human realm they may be respected by some as virtuous ascetics, but it seems that their status as incomparable fields of merit goes by and large unremarked. The commentaries have quite a few stories about people ending up in hell for mistreating paccekabuddhas, or as hungry ghosts for being niggardly towards them, not realizing the enormity of what they're doing. On the other hand, there are stories of people ending up spending aeons in heavenly realms just for giving a paccekabuddha a spoonful of rice.


Ouch! Haha. Seems you had better practice compassion towards all beings, even the random lonely ascetic in the forest, because you never know who you're messing with! :lol:

Dhammanando wrote:In the Sutta Piṭaka the only source is the Cullaniddesa's detailed exposition of the Khaggavisāṇa Sutta. Other than that one has to go to the commentaries. As for a paccekabuddha's practice, this will be covered in the Manop article.


Thank you for the reference info. I'll look it up as soon as I have the chance.

Namaste,
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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby gavesako » Wed Jan 07, 2009 4:15 pm

Although many people in Theravada history are reported to have undertaken the bodhisattva path, there are almost no mentions of individuals who have undertaken the paccekabuddha path. One possible exception is Ajahn Sao, the teacher of Ajahn Mun in his early days in Ubon, who apparently made such a determination (vow). He did not speak much and did not give extensive instructions to his students. It is possible that the story is just a later invention (Ajahn Mun himself is said to have made the bodhisattva vow and later given it up).

Any other cases of paccekabuddha candidates?

Bhikkhu Gavesako
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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby Dhammakid » Sun Jan 11, 2009 2:58 am

Hey Dhammanando,
How's the Manop article coming along?

:namaste:
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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby Dhammakid » Sun Jan 11, 2009 3:00 am

Gavesako,
But I thought Paccekabuddha-hood could only be attained during a sasana when the Dhamma is lost? Or do I have it wrong and it actually can be achieved during the Gotama sasana as long as one doesn't have a teacher?

:namaste:
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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby Dhammanando » Sun Jan 11, 2009 3:03 am

Hi Dhammakid,

Dhammakid wrote:How's the Manop article coming along?


Well, I haven't forgotten about it, but I've been busy with class preparation, so it's had to take a back seat these last few days.

Best wishes,
Dhammanando Bhikkhu
    ...and this thought arose in the mind of the Blessed One:
    “Who lives without reverence lives miserably.”
    Uruvela Sutta, A.ii.20

    It were endless to dispute upon everything that is disputable.
    — William Penn Some Fruits of Solitude,
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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby Dhammakid » Sun Jan 11, 2009 4:00 am

Dhammanando wrote:Hi Dhammakid,

Dhammakid wrote:How's the Manop article coming along?


Well, I haven't forgotten about it, but I've been busy with class preparation, so it's had to take a back seat these last few days.

Best wishes,
Dhammanando Bhikkhu


Yes yes, I totally understand. Hope I didn't come off as rushing you.

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Re: Paccekabuddhas

Postby Will » Tue Jan 20, 2009 12:04 am

Here is a little from Ledi Sayadaw on the subject:

I shall now outline the ten ordinary perfections, the ten higher perfections, and the ten supreme perfections.

All external objects such as a wife and children, animate and inanimate things, belonging to a person, are the objects through which the ten ordinary perfections are fulfilled. One’s own limbs or head or any organs of the body are the objects through which the ten higher perfections are fulfilled. One’s own life (being sacrificed) is the object through which the ten supreme perfections are fulfilled.

Of those three categories of objects, undertakings that forsake the first category are called ordinary perfections. Undertakings that forsake the second are called higher perfections. Those that forsake the third, i.e. one’s own life, are called supreme perfections.

One who can fulfil only the first ten attains the enlightenment of a Noble Disciple. One who can fulfil only the first ten and the second ten attains the enlightenment of a Solitary Buddha. One who can fulfil all thirty attains Supreme Self-Enlightenment....

As to the Noble Disciples: in the commentary on the Suttanipāta there are three types: (i) one who depends on confidence for his enlightenment, (ii) one who depends on diligence, and (iii) one who depends on wisdom.

The Three Types of Solitary Enlightenment

Similarly, Solitary Enlightenment (paccekabodhi) is also of three types. The commentaries say that the enlightenment of a Solitary Buddha is attained after fulfilling the ten perfections and the ten higher perfections for two aeons and a hundred thousand world cycles.
This noble eightfold path is the ancient path traveled by all the Buddhas of eons past. Nagara Sutta
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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby piotr » Tue Jan 27, 2009 2:33 pm

Hi bhante Dhammanando,

How is your translation project going on? :smile: Or did you abandoned it? In connection to the other topic, I was hoping to read something about possibility of female paccekabuddhas. Is it excluded or not? Since Aṅguttara-nikāya mentiones two kinds of the buddhas (pacceka- & sammāsam-), and speaks only about impossibility of female sammāsambuddha, then I assume that female paccekabuddha is not an impossibility. But maybe you can shed more light on that.
Bhagavaṃmūlakā no, bhante, dhammā...
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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby Heavenstorm » Tue Jan 27, 2009 9:27 pm

gavesako wrote:Any other cases of paccekabuddha candidates?


I read before that some stream enterers were reborn during the time of the extinction of Dharma. However, they were at the final stage of seventh rebirth, they had to become Arahants and because Buddha's teachings had disappeared, they were also being labeled as "solitary realizers" or "Paccekabuddha". Not the real deal though..........
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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby Nyanatusita » Tue Feb 10, 2009 1:53 pm

There is a BPS Wheel Publication called The Paccekabuddha: A Buddhist Ascetic, A Study of the Concept of the Paccekabuddha in Pali Canonical and Commentarial Literature by Ria Kloppenborg. It is a abridged version of her larger book. It has not been uploaded yet to the BPS Online Library, but this will probably happen soon. If anyone is interested I could upload it to this forum as an attachment if that is possible.

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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby Dhammakid » Wed Feb 11, 2009 11:06 pm

Nyanatusita wrote:There is a BPS Wheel Publication called The Paccekabuddha: A Buddhist Ascetic, A Study of the Concept of the Paccekabuddha in Pali Canonical and Commentarial Literature by Ria Kloppenborg. It is a abridged version of her larger book. It has not been uploaded yet to the BPS Online Library, but this will probably happen soon. If anyone is interested I could upload it to this forum as an attachment if that is possible.

Bh. Nyanatusita


This a great idea. I'm all for it.

:namaste:
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Re: Paccekabuddhas in Canon & Commentary

Postby retrofuturist » Thu Feb 12, 2009 2:27 am

Greetings bhante,

Nyanatusita wrote:If anyone is interested I could upload it to this forum as an attachment if that is possible.

If you have any problems in doing so, please let me know (and in doing so, please let me know the file format and size).

Metta,
Retro. :)
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One who is such, calmed and ever mindful, He has no sorrows! -- Udana IV, 7


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