pronouncing double s in pali

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Inoshi
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pronouncing double s in pali

Post by Inoshi »

Hello,

Does anybody know off hand if a double s (ss) is pronounced a certain way in Pali?

E.g., in the word vipassana, does the double get an "sh" sound?

:reading:
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tiltbillings
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Re: pronouncing double s in pali

Post by tiltbillings »

rishi wrote:Hello,

Does anybody know off hand if a double s (ss) is pronounced a certain way in Pali?

E.g., in the word vipassana, does the double get an "sh" sound?

:reading:
No. Double "ss" is "s" as in sign. The Pali word vipassanā: vi pas anaa. The accent is in the first sylable. The "vi" as in victor. the "a" as in hut. the final "ā" as in law.

The Sanskrit version of the word, vipaśyanā, the "s" with a dot over it, is pronounced "sh" and the "ya" is pronounced as the "ya" in yatch.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
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cooran
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Re: pronouncing double s in pali

Post by cooran »

Hello rishi,

This might be of assistance:

A Guide to the Pronunciation of Pali
Double consonants must be clearly articulated as two sounds, not merged into one, as is the tendency in European languages. When there is a double consonant it may help to imagine a hyphen between the two letters and pronounce accordingly. Therefore sut-taü, not sutaü (or såtaü); bhik-khu, not bhikhu (or bhãkhu) etc.
http://www.ancient-buddhist-texts.net/R ... f-Pali.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Pali pronunciation
http://www.dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=4323" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

with metta
Chris
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---
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tiltbillings
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Re: pronouncing double s in pali

Post by tiltbillings »

cooran wrote:Hello rishi,

This might be of assistance:

A Guide to the Pronunciation of Pali
Double consonants must be clearly articulated as two sounds, not merged into one, as is the tendency in European languages. When there is a double consonant it may help to imagine a hyphen between the two letters and pronounce accordingly. Therefore sut-taü, not sutaü (or såtaü); bhik-khu, not bhikhu (or bhãkhu) etc.
http://www.ancient-buddhist-texts.net/R ... f-Pali.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
At best a double "s" -- ss -- is going to be an "s" sound with a slightly accented, if that.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
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cooran
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Re: pronouncing double s in pali

Post by cooran »

For pronunciation, these sound-files might be of assistance:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Pali/file ... d%20files/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

with metta
Chris
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---
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Bhikkhu Pesala
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Re: pronouncing double s in pali

Post by Bhikkhu Pesala »

Some common Pali words — Pali Pronunciation
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mikenz66
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Re: pronouncing double s in pali

Post by mikenz66 »

My understanding was that when there is a double syllable the first ends a syllable and the second starts another one.

So bhikkhu is bhik - khu, not bhi - khu or bhik - u
And vipassana is vi-pas-sa-na

However, my experience with Pali is in a Thai context. Thai is very definitely a mono-syllabic (i.e. each syllable stands on it's own) Asian language, so Pali chanting by Thai speakers is mono-syllablic. Since Pali is actually an Indo-European language, and European languages are not monosyllabic (syllable is a handy example - a native English speaker would not pronounce it as syl-la-bull), the Thai-Pali pronunciation is likely to be more monosyllabic than the original.

Of course, "correct" is relative: If one is communally chanting with others the correct thing to do is to fit in! :reading:

:anjali:
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Inoshi
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Re: pronouncing double s in pali

Post by Inoshi »

Thanks everybody. I was wondering a bit about the word "upassaya", very helpful all.
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