Itivuttaka 4.4 - Recluses and Brahmins

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Itivuttaka 4.4 - Recluses and Brahmins

Postby mikenz66 » Wed Aug 28, 2013 9:01 pm

Itivuttaka 4.4
Translated by Thanissaro Bhikkhu


http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... ml#iti-103


This was said by the Blessed One, said by the Arahant, so I have heard: "Any brahmans or contemplatives who do not discern, as it actually is present, that 'This is stress,'... that 'This is the origination of stress,'... that 'This is the cessation of stress,' who do not discern, as it actually is present, that 'This is the path of practice leading to the cessation of stress': to me these brahmans & contemplatives do not count as brahmans among brahmans or as contemplatives among contemplatives. Furthermore, they do not enter & remain in the goal of the priestly life or the goal of the contemplative life, having directly known & made it manifest for themselves right in the present life.

"But any brahmans or contemplatives who discern, as it actually is present, that 'This is stress,'... that 'This is the origination of stress,'... that 'This is the cessation of stress,' who discern, as it actually is present, that 'This is the path of practice leading to the cessation of stress': to me these brahmans & contemplatives count as brahmans among brahmans and as contemplatives among contemplatives. Furthermore, they enter & remain in the goal of the priestly life & the goal of the contemplative life, having directly known & made it manifest for themselves right in the present life."


Those who don't discern stress,
its cause,
& where it totally stops,
without trace,
who don't know the path,
the way to the stilling of stress:
lowly
in their awareness-release
& discernment-release,
incapable
of making an end,
they're headed
to birth & aging.

But those who discern stress,
its cause,
& where it totally stops,
without trace,
who discern the path,
the way to the stilling of stress:
consummate
in their awareness-release
& discernment-release,
capable
of making an end,
they are not headed
to birth & aging.

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mikenz66
Posts: 10782
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:37 am
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Re: Itivuttaka 4.4 - Recluses and Brahmins

Postby mikenz66 » Fri Aug 30, 2013 9:33 am

John Ireland's Translation.

This was said by the Lord...

"Bhikkus, whatever recluses and brahmins do not understand as it actually is: 'This is suffering'; 'This is the origin of suffering'; 'This is the cessation of suffering'; 'This is the course leading to the cessation of suffering' --- these reclusese and brahmins are not considered by me to be true recluses among recluses, to be true brahmins among brahmins. These venerable ones live without having realized and achieved here and now by their own directs knowledge the aim of being a recluse, the aim of being a brahmin.

"But, Bhikkus, whatever recluses and brahmins understand as it actually is: 'This is suffering'; 'This is the origin of suffering'; 'This is the cessation of suffering'; 'This is the course leading to the cessation of suffering' --- these reclusese and brahmins are considered by me to be true recluses among recluses, to be true brahmins among brahmins. These venerable ones indeed live having achieved and realized here and now by their own directs knowledge the aim of being a recluse, the aim of being a brahmin.

    Those who do not understand suffering,
    Or how suffering is produced,
    Or where suffering finally stops,
    Altogether without remainder,
    And who do not know that path
    Leading to relief from suffering ---
    They are destitute of mind-release
    And lack release by wisdom too;
    Unable to make an end of it,
    They fare on in birth and decay.

    But those who understand suffering,
    And how suffering is produced,
    And where suffering finally stops,
    Altogether without remainder,
    And who also know that path
    Leading to relief from suffering ---
    They posses that mind-release
    And the release by wisdom too;
    Able to make an end of it,
    They never come back to birth and decay.


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