Tsetan wrote:I would do that in a heartbeat, but student loans, as far as I know, are not discharged with bankruptcy. I is true that I am not obligated, just by having these student loans, to actively seek employment. Also, the feds insure the lender will be repaid in this program, thus I do not feel it would be stealing if I did not pay on them as a monk. Now the feds have to get the money somewhere, but frankly, I do not feel any moral issue, personally, with them repaying the lender. The feds do not mind using my money to pay to bomb people in foreign lands, thus I'm not sure I'd mind them paying my loan so I can cultivate compassion 24/7 as a monk. I'm just thinking out loud right now... All this stuff is very arguable of course.
so I can cultivate compassion 24/7 as a monk
marcpiano wrote:Hi all,
Is a UK student loan (ie through the Student Loans Company rather than a private arrangement between an individual and a bank) considered a debt for the purposes of fulfilling the pre-requisites for ordination?
Its repayment is linked to earnings (so if you're unemployed, you don't pay it back until you gain employment) and it is automatically cleared after 25 years.
Thanks in advance!
James the Giant wrote:If I knew a bhikkhu had a student loan, personally I would not consider him a properly ordained bhikkhu, despite the legal loopholes which enable him to not pay it back. It's against the "spirit" of the rule. I certainly would not respect him as much as a proper debt- and obligation-free monk.
Mal wrote:In what way is it against the "spirit" of the rule?
The monk would only have an obligation if he earned a certain amount of money, otherwise he has no obligation.
Mal wrote:If he was shown to, truly, be in debt could he even be a monk?
James the Giant wrote:Mal wrote:The point is that he is a debtor. He has a debt. He is a debtor and the rule is quite clear on that point:
"A debtor should not be given the Going-forth. Whoever should give it: an offense of wrong doing." — Mv.I.46.1
Whether he is obliged to pay it later, or when he reaches a certain level of income, he still has a debt and is therefore not eligible.
James the Giant wrote:A loan is a loan. A debt is a debt. Anything else is playing word games, trying to weasel a way around the clear and simple rule.
Ask the senior monk under whom you would want to take dependence. His opinion is the only one that matters, because he will either say "yes" and you get to become a monk, or he will say "no" and you will have to find a job for a few years before you can become a monk.
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