Practice Buddhism and listening metal and goth music

[Mkoll]

Music-wise, you don't have much choice in what you enjoy listening to.

As a music teacher I have to disagree. Appreciation and enjoyment of particular styles of music is learned, usually informally but still learned. Most people like what they know - and that's the way it works, not 'know what they like'.
If anyone wants to get to enjoy other kinds of music from what they know, they can just expand the boundaries of what they listen to and follow their ears.
Techno to trance to Philip Glass? Sure.
Country and Western to blues to jazz? Sure.
Just don't expect to jump straight from death metal to medieval motets and understand them straight away.


Kim

Well that'se true if someone has a willingness to experiment with new genres and they find the right stuff for them. I would also differentiate between appreciation and enjoyment. I appreciate much much music than I enjoy, let's put it that way.

There are certain genres that I know I will never like, like gabber for example. And I'm sure most people have certain styles of music that they just cannot get into.

[Kim OHara]

Music-wise, you don't have much choice in what you enjoy listening to.

As a music teacher I have to disagree. Appreciation and enjoyment of particular styles of music is learned, usually informally but still learned. Most people like what they know - and that's the way it works, not 'know what they like'.
If anyone wants to get to enjoy other kinds of music from what they know, they can just expand the boundaries of what they listen to and follow their ears.
Techno to trance to Philip Glass? Sure.
Country and Western to blues to jazz? Sure.
Just don't expect to jump straight from death metal to medieval motets and understand them straight away.


Kim

Well that'se true if someone has a willingness to experiment with new genres and they find the right stuff for them. I would also differentiate between appreciation and enjoyment. I appreciate much much music than I enjoy, let's put it that way.

There are certain genres that I know I will never like, like gabber for example. And I'm sure most people have certain styles of music that they just cannot get into.

Gabber doesn't sound like my kind of music either but I think "cannot get into" is really "refuse to get into" or "will never want to get into". Given enough encouragement (it often takes an attractive person of the opposite sex ) I believe nearly anyone can learn to like nearly any music.
But this is all OT. Let's leave it at that.


Kim

[TheNoBSBuddhist]

......
Gabber doesn't sound like my kind of music either but I think "cannot get into" is really "refuse to get into" or "will never want to get into". Given enough encouragement (it often takes an attractive person of the opposite sex ) I believe nearly anyone can learn to like nearly any music.

Not if, like me you actually suffer from Hyperacusis. It's bordering on Misophonia.

[Kim OHara]

......
Gabber doesn't sound like my kind of music either but I think "cannot get into" is really "refuse to get into" or "will never want to get into". Given enough encouragement (it often takes an attractive person of the opposite sex ) I believe nearly anyone can learn to like nearly any music.

Not if, like me you actually suffer from Hyperacusis. It's bordering on Misophonia.

You have my sympathy but I did say nearly everyone ... and I did say too.
Or has the OP already received a good-enough answer to the question?


Kim

[TheNoBSBuddhist]

I don't know; that would be up to the OP. But I suppose it's one reason as to why some people can listen to certain types of music, and others cannot. And constant exposure to music of the specific genre the OP has referred to, is also conducive to harming the hearing.... I'm wondering whether the OP has any associated problems which may be connected to such an activity? Further good reason to refrain....

[wolf1]

THANK YOU VERY MUCH!!!!

BUT WHAT IS DHAMMA FOLLOWER AND FAITH FOLLOWER? CAN ANYBODY DETAILS IT? PLEASE.

There is some discussion of this in SN 55.24

Take the case of another man. He is not even endowed with unwavering devotion to the Buddha, the Dhamma, the Sangha. He is not joyous and swift in wisdom and has not gained release. But perhaps he has these things: the faculty of faith, of energy, of mindfulness, of concentration, of wisdom. And the things proclaimed by the Tathaagata are moderately approved by him with insight. That man does not go to the realm of hungry ghosts, to the downfall, to the evil way, to states of woe.

Take the case of another man. He is not even endowed with unwavering devotion to the Buddha, the Dhamma, the Sangha. He is not joyous and swift in wisdom and has not gained release. But he has just these things: the faculty of faith, of energy, of mindfulness, of concentration, of wisdom. Yet if he has merely faith, merely affection for the Tathaagata, that man, too, does not go to... states of woe.

[alan]

There certainly is a difference between noise and music. Jazz, of instance, opens the brain to new pathways of perception and frees the spirit to soar. Appreciating it is a lifelong learning experience which reveals new dimensions as one grows more aware.

Metal or Goth? Might as well just go out to a construction site and put my ear up to the jackhammer. Or sit by the side of the highway, listening to big trucks lumbering by as they spew diesel smoke.

[Mkoll]

Well, since the OP seems satisfied that their question has been answered, I'll continue contributing to this OT discussion.

~~~

There certainly is a difference between noise and music. Jazz, of instance, opens the brain to new pathways of perception and frees the spirit to soar. Appreciating it is a lifelong learning experience which reveals new dimensions as one grows more aware.

Metal or Goth? Might as well just go out to a construction site and put my ear up to the jackhammer. Or sit by the side of the highway, listening to big trucks lumbering by as they spew diesel smoke.

All I'm hearing is that you don't like metal and goth and you never will. That's fine. But it's still music and being snobbish about it isn't going to change that fact. Even noise can be music.

[alan]

Then you're not listening.
Show me how noise is beneficial.

[alan]

In the suttas we often encounter a group talking nonsense, blathering on. The Buddha always admonishes them.
Is he being a snob?
I would say no, he's justly advising against foolish noise. What is noise? That which does not produce beneficial results or add to the quality of your mind.
What adds to the quality of your mind? That which increases awareness, that which cleanses, that which inspires.

[Mkoll]

In the suttas we often encounter a group talking nonsense, blathering on. The Buddha always admonishes them.
Is he being a snob?
I would say no, he's justly advising against foolish noise. What is noise? That which does not produce beneficial results or add to the quality of your mind.
What adds to the quality of your mind? That which increases awareness, that which cleanses, that which inspires.

False analogy. We're not talking about the Buddha's teaching right now. We're talking about music.

You're saying that since you don't like to listen to goth or metal music, therefore goth and metal music aren't music.
It's like saying since I don't like to eat oatmeal or raisins, therefore oatmeal and raisins aren't foods.

And for the record, oatmeal and raisins are great; I'm just using them as examples.

[alan]

Thought it was a decent analogy, but let's put that aside for now. Question is: what do you want to feed your mind?

[Mkoll]

Clearly, hoping you would see that goth and metal are valid forms of music was a bad idea. I'll exit this debate with a final word from Wikipedia.

Heavy metal (or simply metal) is a genre of rock music[1] that developed in the late 1960s and early 1970s, largely in the United Kingdom and the United States.

Gothic rock (also referred to as goth rock or simply goth) is a musical subgenre of post-punk and alternative rock that formed during the late 1970s.

[alan]

And worthless noise is a subcategory of other forms of noise, all of which do not contribute to peace of mind, which is why I avoid them.

[alan]

What is beautiful music? Charlie Parker riffing on a melody, taking it to the sublime. Or maybe, if you're not a Jazz cat, a singer-song-writer expressing emotion. Maybe it's a pop band coming up with new melodies.
No matter what your preference, there is no doubt that some sounds elevate, and others do not. Music, like all other art forms, is at it's best when it aims high.