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5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts - Dhamma Wheel

5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Buddhist ethical conduct including the Five Precepts (Pañcasikkhāpada), and Eightfold Ethical Conduct (Aṭṭhasīla).
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retrofuturist
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5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby retrofuturist » Fri Jan 02, 2009 9:38 am

"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby Fede » Fri Jan 02, 2009 10:41 am

If I may....

I recite the Five to myself, morning and evening.
I also occasionally surprise myself by thinking of them during the day. They seem to flash upon my "inward eye" and bring me back 'to Centre', which is pleasant.
As for the additional three, I do these at any time that there is a Buddhist festival, and on the rare occasions that I am on my own (and my partner is absent for any short period of time, on a conference for example, or on a long weekend awway to visit his son...)
It's a rare opportunity to practise discipline and engage in a mini-retreat all of my own.....

Thank you.
"Samsara: The human condition's heartbreaking inability to sustain contentment." Elizabeth Gilbert, 'Eat, Pray, Love'.

Simplify: 17 into 1 WILL go: Mindfulness!

Quieta movere magna merces videbatur. (Sallust, c.86-c.35 BC)
Translation: Just to stir things up seemed a good reward in itself. ;)

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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby Cittasanto » Fri Jan 02, 2009 10:49 am

Hi retro,
I only directly follow the eight precepts on retreat as being a Chef with all that involves with shift work etc it is hard to keep to a particular day per week or to the actual observance days!
personally I find remembering the Eightfold Path more useful than remembering the precepts directly, although I am doing that at the same time!


He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby Ben » Fri Jan 02, 2009 11:49 am

During retreats (sitting or serving) I pick up the additional three precepts.
In day-to-day life I actually think it is more beneficial to observe the five precepts as strictly as possible rather than not do a great job of the eight. My experience is that the closer one observes the precepts the more receptive one is to the Dhamma and the more efficacious one's practice becomes.
Kind regards

Ben
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby jcsuperstar » Fri Jan 02, 2009 1:33 pm

i only do the 8(or 10) when living at the Wat
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby retrofuturist » Fri Jan 02, 2009 11:04 pm

Greetings,

My experience here is similar to most of yours.

I do the first five as best I can, but I'm also quite mindful of #7 throughout daily life too. I love music and thanks to my practice I can now enjoy it without being quite so obsessive about it. It also accords with my general disinterest in fashion, so that's nice. ;)

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby zamis » Sat Jan 03, 2009 3:54 pm

Losing fear of following no meal after 12 has added a great deal of confidence. What I thought would be a very poor dietary decision turned out to be a great one, so I follow the eight on a more or less regular basis. I've been following 7 since life circumstances allow for it -
"You're almost at the end of your lease in this burning house and yet you continue latching onto it as your self. It tricks you into feeling fear and love, and when you fall for it, what path will you practice? " Upasika Kee Nanayon


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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby Jason » Sun Jan 04, 2009 2:13 am

Retro,

I usually only observe the eight precepts when I am staying at a Buddhist temple for an extended period of time, such as for meditation retreats, etc. Other than that, I find the five precepts to be sufficient. The main reason is that, to me, the extra precepts are simply there to foster a contemplative atmosphere and are designed to be supportive to meditation practice, but they tend to get in the way of my day-to-day life. For example, working a physically demanding full time job with a short lunch break makes the precept to refrain from "eating at the forbidden time" rather impractical. Besides that, as a lay-follower, I also enjoy things like listening to music, reading just for pleasure, watching movies, etc. Plus, I think that Ben makes a good point about it being better to observe the five precepts really well rather than observing the eight poorly.

Jason
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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby Dhammakid » Mon Jan 05, 2009 1:44 am

Hello everyone,
My experience is just about the same. Actually, I have never followed the Eight Precepts fully. Even on the couple of meditation retreats I've attended, we have eaten after noon. Part of this is because I've never even been to a Buddhist temple before, so I've never had a practical reason to follow the Eight Precepts other than if I was feeling up to it on my own. However, I have made the decision in the past to follow Eight Precepts on Uposatha observance days, I just haven't gotten around to doing it yet. Maybe for the one coming up...

I think it would be quite nice to regularly follow Eight Precepts if life circumstances allowed it. But I'm pretty sure I'm going to become a monk, so I'll have plenty of rules to follow then. Maybe I should focus on being the best lay person I can be for now :D

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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby fig tree » Sun Jan 11, 2009 7:36 am


pererin

Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby pererin » Sun Jan 11, 2009 11:53 am

When I came to Buddhist practice I found that the Five had already been a part of my life, though I have to be honest and say that I am trying to work out the practical implications of the first precept. The decision to observe the Eight as a way of life would in effect be making choices for my partner too, and that is something to be considered.

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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby Will » Sun Jan 11, 2009 3:36 pm

A bodhisattva does not become weary of evil beings nor does he commit the error of bringing forth thoughts inclined to reject them and cast them aside. Avatamsaka Sutra, ch. 25

pererin

Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby pererin » Sun Jan 11, 2009 3:53 pm

That is very helpful, Will - thank you. What are the four points of the lunar cycle?

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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby Will » Sun Jan 11, 2009 3:58 pm

A bodhisattva does not become weary of evil beings nor does he commit the error of bringing forth thoughts inclined to reject them and cast them aside. Avatamsaka Sutra, ch. 25

pererin

Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby pererin » Sun Jan 11, 2009 4:06 pm

:oops:

Don't worry about me - I'm just having another senior moment day ...

:rofl:

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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby Dhammakid » Sun Jan 11, 2009 5:03 pm

Hello Pererin,
What are the practical implications of the First Precept you are having trouble with?

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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby David N. Snyder » Mon Jan 12, 2009 8:10 pm

I follow the five precepts and attempt to do the 8 on most days. I don't specifically make a vow or chant the precepts, but just attempt to do as many of the 8 daily. For me, not eating beyond noon is easy since I work from home. Not wearing cosmetics is also easy, as is sleeping on a low bed and not listening to music and shows. I guess as I got old, I mostly lost interest in Top 40 music, so it was easy more so than any 'achievement.

I feel better and more relaxed when the 8 are followed. It could be from greater mindfulness or it could be that there is no feeling of guilt when I don't break any of the 8 precepts. Time and meditation will tell. :yingyang: :meditate:
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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby bodom » Fri Jan 16, 2009 9:55 pm

As for me i am waiting until after football season to start observing the Uposatha and 8 precepts. Its the playoffs and it just so happens that the Uposatha days have been falling on saturdays and sundays when its game day. Football is one attachment im not ready to let go of yet lol. Other than that 5 precepts everyday in so far as i am able.

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To practice is to know your defilements,
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pererin

Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby pererin » Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:11 am


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Re: 5 Precepts vs 8 Precepts

Postby Dhammakid » Sat Jan 17, 2009 6:49 am

Hahaha, I agree! I do love me some football though :lol:

I should rededicate myself to following the 8 during the observance days. I feel I will greatly benefit from it.

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