why drowsiness give pleasure?

Discussion of Samatha bhavana and Jhana bhavana.
barcsimalsi
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why drowsiness give pleasure?

Postby barcsimalsi » Sat Mar 16, 2013 4:43 am

I find it easier to meditate when my mind is slightly to moderately drowsy. There is a pleasant sensation accompanying almost every breath but when the energy is back, the drowsiness is gone so as the pleaseful feeling. Then my mind became active and restless as usual.

As i had practiced meditation and studying the dhamma for quite some time, i manage to not cling to the pleasant feeling that arise( in meditation), hence aversion is not the problem.

From the suttas, it explained that the pleasant feeling of meditation is suppose to bring the mind to relaxation, tranquility and eventually leads to equanimity. I had experienced the former 2 but no where is equanimity whereas the tranquility of mind seems to depend on the pleasant sensation which will cease anytime. Furthermore, i'm not sure the pleasant sensation i'm experiencing is the same from what the sutta describes.

I failed to see if there's anyway on prolonging the pleasant sensation that arise from being drowsy yet i can't meditate well when my mind is energetic. Is there something wrong with me? Need advice.

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Bhikkhu Pesala
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Re: why drowsiness give pleasure?

Postby Bhikkhu Pesala » Sat Mar 16, 2013 5:40 am

Getting attached to the pleasant feeling experienced when the mind is concentrated is clearly a potential problem. How do you react if someone or something rouses you from your tranquillity, e.g. by banging a door, etc.?

Drowsiness is a hindrance. If the mind becomes dull, get up and do some walking meditation. It is recommended to alternate walking with sitting to balance the energies. Excessive energy will lead to restlessness, while excessive concentration will lead to drowsiness.

Like drowsiness, restlessness is just another one of the five hindrances. It should be observed and contemplated as “Restless, restless,” until it disappears. Drowsiness is somewhat difficult to note clearly and precisely, because the mind is dull.

Hindrances and Antidotes
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barcsimalsi
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Re: why drowsiness give pleasure?

Postby barcsimalsi » Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:50 am

Thanks for your guidance.

Aim: The Antidote for Sloth and Torpor
The jhānic factor of vitakka or aim has the specific power to open and refresh the mind. It makes the mind alive and open. Thus, when the mind is continually and diligently trying to be accurate in aiming at the object, sloth and torpor do not arise. A mind attacked by drowsiness is a mind that has been constricted and withered. Vitakka is the antidote to thina middha.

Often, it was joy that free my mind from drowsiness and restlessness.

Following your advice of doing walking meditation to counter drowsiness, yes it works on refreshing the mind but when i regulate to sitting meditation with a fresh mind, i rarely got the same joyful sensation which hit me when meditating during drowsy mind. Thus had a hard time dealing with restlessness. Like the title says, i still can't figure out why pleasant feeling arise more often when i was drowsy(not heavily), need more advice.

To be clear, i'm not being attached to pleasant feeling. It is just that i need it to deal with both drowsiness and restlessness. My mindfulness and concentration are not as intense without it during meditation.

makarasilapin
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Re: why drowsiness give pleasure?

Postby makarasilapin » Sat Mar 16, 2013 1:12 pm

i would contact a meditation teacher rather than ask people on an internet forum

barcsimalsi
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Re: why drowsiness give pleasure?

Postby barcsimalsi » Sat Mar 16, 2013 1:48 pm

makarasilapin wrote:i would contact a meditation teacher rather than ask people on an internet forum

Thanks, was thinking the same yet i'm still interested with the variety of answers might get from this forum and was confident with the knowledge and wisdom of many forum members whom i think are equally capable of teaching.

makarasilapin
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Re: why drowsiness give pleasure?

Postby makarasilapin » Sat Mar 16, 2013 4:33 pm

barcsimalsi wrote:
makarasilapin wrote:i would contact a meditation teacher rather than ask people on an internet forum

Thanks, was thinking the same yet i'm still interested with the variety of answers might get from this forum and was confident with the knowledge and wisdom of many forum members whom i think are equally capable of teaching.


you'll just pick out a response that agrees with you.

equally capable of teaching? to someone like Thanissaro Bhikkhu?

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Bhikkhu Pesala
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Re: why drowsiness give pleasure?

Postby Bhikkhu Pesala » Sat Mar 16, 2013 5:23 pm

makarasilapin wrote:you'll just pick out a response that agrees with you.

You could also just pick out a meditation teacher who agrees with you. :stirthepot:

There are many reasons why people find it more convenient to visit a forum, but I agree with you that it is better to practice face to face with a teacher if you have that option.
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