Vipassana Jhana

Discussion of Samatha bhavana and Jhana bhavana.
Myotai
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Vipassana Jhana

Postby Myotai » Thu Oct 24, 2013 11:03 am

Hi all,

Just heard a talk by Joseph Goldstein talking about 'Vipassana Jhana'....I thought Jhana was Jhana? :quote:

:shrug:

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Modus.Ponens
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Re: Vipassana Jhana

Postby Modus.Ponens » Thu Oct 24, 2013 11:21 am

Here we go again. :)

The thing is that there is a difference in interpretations on what is jhana: one side interprets it as a state in which you don't feel the body and are unnable apply that concentration to vipassana (hard jhanas); the other side interprets it as a state of concentration which is fluid enough so you can feel your body and apply that concentration to vipassana (sutta jhanas).

The thing with the vipassana jhanas is that they are basicaly the sutta jhanas applied to investigation of phenomena: vipassana jhanas. Since this experience of jhana applied to insight came up in the context of an understanding of jhana as hard jhana, they called those states vipassana jhanas. But basicaly they are jhanas being used to get insight
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

Myotai
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Re: Vipassana Jhana

Postby Myotai » Thu Oct 24, 2013 11:24 am

Modus.Ponens wrote:Here we go again. :)


Sorry....I know there is debate as to the efficacy and legitimacy of Jhana but I just wasn't aware of something called Vipassana Jhana specifically

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Modus.Ponens
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Re: Vipassana Jhana

Postby Modus.Ponens » Thu Oct 24, 2013 11:45 am

Don't worry. It was a tongue in cheek coment. In this thread is actualy apropriate to bring the jhana debate because there is no way to properly answer your question without mentioning it.

Metta. :)
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

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Bhikkhu Pesala
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Re: Vipassana Jhana

Postby Bhikkhu Pesala » Thu Oct 24, 2013 12:35 pm

Read this chapter by Joseph Goldstein's teacher to understand better.

The Vipassanā Jhānas
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robertk
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Re: Vipassana Jhana

Postby robertk » Thu Oct 24, 2013 1:00 pm

the pali describes both arammanupanijhana and lakkhanupanijhana,(eg dhammpada commentary 372 -)
lakkhanupanijhana is what the venerable means as "vipassana jhana"

Myotai
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Re: Vipassana Jhana

Postby Myotai » Thu Oct 24, 2013 1:13 pm

Bhikkhu Pesala wrote:Read this chapter by Joseph Goldstein's teacher to understand better.

The Vipassanā Jhānas


...perfect, thanks!

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mikenz66
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Re: Vipassana Jhana

Postby mikenz66 » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:36 pm



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