a couple questions

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a couple questions

Postby thatoneguy » Thu Mar 31, 2011 12:04 am

hi
i am just exploring the buddhist faith, i don't really know much about it but i do have a couple questions about differing oppinions. i am wondering about arrogance according to the buddhist faith, and since i am not really experienced in the teachings, i feel i do not use much tact when i am discussing religion in general. i seem to have some anger towards anybody who thinks they have all the answers and criticize the many spiritual traditions of the world including people who think there is no place for a spiritual life or people who think they are the one and only key to a spiritual life. so i guess what i am asking is this: am i arrogant in my thinking if i am just exploring buddhism and call myself a buddhist and also what is the proper way to deal with arrogance in other people who criticize things they do not understand. i hope my questions make sense thanks for any input, and i am sorry if i have wasted your time.
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Re: a couple questions

Postby Ben » Thu Mar 31, 2011 12:52 am

Greetings thatoneguy and welcome to Dhamma Wheel.

am i arrogant in my thinking if i am just exploring buddhism and call myself a buddhist?
It depends on your intention. If you line of enquiry is genuine, if you have gone for refuge in the triple gem and it wasn't just an empty ritual, if you have some level of confidence that the Buddha's Dhamma is beneficial on some level, if you are engaging with the practice then no, its probably not arrogance. If however you are calling yourself a Buddhist for the sake of impressing others then it is an act of conceit.

what is the proper way to deal with arrogance in other people who criticize things they do not understand?
First and fundamentally, you need to concern yourself with your own ignorance. You need to develop sila (morality), samadhi (concentration) and panna (wisdom). Apart from that, concern yourself with correcting errors of fact - if the situation is appropriate.
kind regards

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Re: a couple questions

Postby thatoneguy » Thu Mar 31, 2011 1:49 am

thank you for you insights
this is what i pretty much get from all my friends and family. the fact that i have to commit myself to really understanding what i am claiming to be. and it would be for the best to commit myself to a more deep understanding and pracitice of the teachings of the buddha. and i really do have a deep desire to actually commit myself to buddhist understanding despite the voice of my mother in the back of my head that keeps telling me that i was raised a christian (although i never really was). and i know that if i don't actually live a right life according to the dhamma i really have no claim to calling myself a buddhist.
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Re: a couple questions

Postby Fede » Thu Mar 31, 2011 1:04 pm

Panna - Wisdom - also covers the benign quality of 'Acceptance'.

Acceptance that religions form the bedrock of different people, in different cultures in different ways, and that people, under the banner of their chosen religion, can either -

Be easy-going, relaxed individuals with a generous nature, a kind disposition and a quiet dedication to accomplishing the task in hand and responding lovingly to their calling in dealing with others,

- or -

Can be hard-lined, insistent, aggressive, zealous, over-bearing, fanatical extremists believing for whatever reasons they may have, that they are right, and everyone else is wrong, lost, misguided, condemned to eternal damnation and the devil's spawn.

The Buddha encouraged us to consort with the Wise, and to shun Fools.
People in the former camp, even if they hold different views to yours, can be great companions on the path, and teach us much about what they believe, and about ourselves and our views too.
People in the latter camp - are best avoided.

I would further suggest that whatever calling you choose to follow, you decide which camp you'd prefer to be in. :smile:


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Translation: Just to stir things up seemed a good reward in itself. ;)

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Re: a couple questions

Postby Digity » Thu Mar 31, 2011 4:31 pm

thatoneguy wrote:hi
i am just exploring the buddhist faith, i don't really know much about it but i do have a couple questions about differing oppinions. i am wondering about arrogance according to the buddhist faith, and since i am not really experienced in the teachings, i feel i do not use much tact when i am discussing religion in general. i seem to have some anger towards anybody who thinks they have all the answers and criticize the many spiritual traditions of the world including people who think there is no place for a spiritual life or people who think they are the one and only key to a spiritual life. so i guess what i am asking is this: am i arrogant in my thinking if i am just exploring buddhism and call myself a buddhist and also what is the proper way to deal with arrogance in other people who criticize things they do not understand. i hope my questions make sense thanks for any input, and i am sorry if i have wasted your time.


I can relate. I use to have heated debates with Christians and think they were stupid for believing what they believed. Looking back, I'm embarrassed by my behaviour. I've recently done some charity work with other Christians and my attitude towards has changed a great deal...it's much more wholesome. Back when I would argue with Christians about their faith I would often claim that Buddhism was the proper path. However, I really only had a superficial understanding of Buddhism. That being said, I still felt it was the proper path. Years have gone by now and my understanding of Buddhism has deepened and oddly enough I'm now much more appreciative of other religions.

I think the key is to keep exploring Buddhism and see where it takes you. Your attitudes and opinions will likely transform and you walk along the path. It's just part of the process,, so don't get too caught up in how you feel now.
Samsara sucks.
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Re: a couple questions

Postby rowyourboat » Fri Apr 01, 2011 9:27 am

People clash over beliefs and views, rather than practices. BE Buddhist rather than say you are or pit your views against theirs. We can appreciate their charitable side as well.

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Re: a couple questions

Postby unspoken » Sun Apr 03, 2011 4:53 am

If you really experienced it, you really KNOW the truth about the topic you arguing or debating about, and they refuse to accept your facts and ideas. Then what you can do is, wish them well and happy. Thinking now he suffer from delusions, hope that he/she will be much wiser, not to fall into some never-ending sufferings caused by confusions and delusions. If they do not accept, then do not tell them. Learn to live the path of the wise, tell when they wanted to listen.
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Re: a couple questions

Postby thatoneguy » Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:15 am

um, hi i just want to ask one more question to anybody still replying to this topic just for claryfication. is it just a fact of life that since i'm still pretty young that i still have much to learn and also is it still considered unskilled ,if, when i get angry at people who i feel to be "arogant", the most i do is maybe get worked up in discussion with friends about my feelings. i guess what i'm trying to say is if i make sure to not get in any major conflicts with those whom i disagree, even though i may have strong feelings against "arogant" people, is it still a hinderance in my life according to buddhist teachings. i hope that my question makes sense. thank you for any insights you may have lend me.
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Re: a couple questions

Postby unspoken » Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:56 am

thatoneguy wrote:um, hi i just want to ask one more question to anybody still replying to this topic just for claryfication. is it just a fact of life that since i'm still pretty young that i still have much to learn and also is it still considered unskilled

Being young does not meant unskilled. Do differentiate that knowing the Dhamma is not reading Dhamma books a lot. But through realizations. If you consider reading a lot of Dhamma books, knowing the life of the Buddha well, completely memorize the Tripitaka, you are still stuck in samsara. That is unskillful. Buddhism and other religion in general differs plenty. They will think by knowing the "words of Gods" they will be liberated from sufferings. The fact is, they are just ignoring the sufferings more and more.


,if, when i get angry at people who i feel to be "arogant", the most i do is maybe get worked up in discussion with friends about my feelings. i guess what i'm trying to say is if i make sure to not get in any major conflicts with those whom i disagree, even though i may have strong feelings against "arogant" people, is it still a hinderance in my life according to buddhist teachings.


Everyone here still have plenty of hindrances, that's why we are here. Don't think too much on hindrances or not, just think if the "arrogant" ones disagree with you, then just leave it there. Some day they sure will seek for the Truth in life. If they do not accept now, then there's no point to argue with them about things you said.
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Re: a couple questions

Postby Fede » Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:40 am

thatoneguy wrote:um, hi i just want to ask one more question to anybody still replying to this topic just for claryfication. is it just a fact of life that since i'm still pretty young that i still have much to learn and also is it still considered unskilled ,if, when i get angry at people who i feel to be "arogant", the most i do is maybe get worked up in discussion with friends about my feelings. i guess what i'm trying to say is if i make sure to not get in any major conflicts with those whom i disagree, even though i may have strong feelings against "arogant" people, is it still a hinderance in my life according to buddhist teachings. i hope that my question makes sense. thank you for any insights you may have lend me.


TOG, I will simply tell you how it is with me;

Whatever people say, or however they act, remember this:
The interpretation of what or who they are, is yours, and yours alone.
Accuse the boastful of being boastful, the arrogant of being arrogant, the conceited of being conceited, and they will all excuse, deny and justify.
So the impression that they are boastful, arrogant or conceited, will be your perception.

Perception is often Deception.
The important thing is not to note how you perceive them, but to note that you think it to begin with.

See that the factor is not: "this man is arrogant", but rather should be, "I see this man as behaving arrogantly".

Question your perception, and see it as a judgement.

Understand that whatever quality you may perceive in someone, the quality is merely a manifestation of their suffering, their grasping, clinging and unskilful attachment.

People want to be right.
If people want to be right, it's because any other result indicates that they're wrong, and if they're wrong, it means they're not in control of everything that is going on in their lives.

Accept that people need to do this. They need to validate their own existence by having their assertion confirmed. Even through blustering and steam-roller-ing others.

A shrug of the shoulders and a simple "Ok, if that's the way you see it, I'm glad it works for you" can do wonders for both them and you.

remember also my point above, about choosing with whom to consort.
Work out who the wise are, and who the foolish are.

it will mean you extricating yourself from connections with people you have hitherto been close to.
That's an attachment you will have to deal with.
"Samsara: The human condition's heartbreaking inability to sustain contentment." Elizabeth Gilbert, 'Eat, Pray, Love'.

Simplify: 17 into 1 WILL go: Mindfulness!

Quieta movere magna merces videbatur. (Sallust, c.86-c.35 BC)
Translation: Just to stir things up seemed a good reward in itself. ;)

I am sooooo happy - How on earth could I be otherwise?! :D


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Re: a couple questions

Postby unspoken » Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:35 pm

:goodpost:
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