Conversations with devas

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retrofuturist
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Conversations with devas

Postby retrofuturist » Sun Mar 22, 2009 5:13 am

"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby David N. Snyder » Sun Mar 22, 2009 5:57 am

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retrofuturist
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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby retrofuturist » Sun Mar 22, 2009 6:01 am

Greetings TheDhamma,

I think one of the earlier Thai Forest monks (was it Ajahn Mun?) supposedly saw devas, and I understand that such comments were not without controversy.

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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SeerObserver
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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby SeerObserver » Sun Mar 22, 2009 6:21 am

There are many accounts of people encountering pretas. This is also met with skepticism, although less so than encounters with devas. It seems easy to believe that pretas linger and make themselves known in order for us to be able to help them somehow. People seem to have a hard time believing devas are sometimes in need of the same. This post from is relevant.

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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby Cittasanto » Sun Mar 22, 2009 9:26 am

this is the only thing that came to mind it is quite a long video and the info is through out although I am not convinced

http://www.consciousmedianetwork.com/me ... gibson.htm


He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby jcsuperstar » Sun Mar 22, 2009 2:49 pm

i dont think it's mun's talking with devas that causes problems, it's his talking with arahants that people take issue with.. :juggling:
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby retrofuturist » Sun Mar 22, 2009 10:21 pm

"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby jcsuperstar » Sun Mar 22, 2009 10:49 pm

i'm not sure... i never read the whole bio... :embarassed:
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby retrofuturist » Sun Mar 22, 2009 11:26 pm

"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby nathan » Sun Mar 22, 2009 11:36 pm

But whoever walking, standing, sitting, or lying down overcomes thought, delighting in the stilling of thought: he's capable, a monk like this, of touching superlative self-awakening. § 110. {Iti 4.11; Iti 115}

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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby rowyourboat » Tue Mar 24, 2009 7:05 pm

i think I agree with nathan on this. Interestingly the Buddha asks ven sariputta whether buddhas of the past appeared to him, and he says no, in one sutta. This is the closest I have got to seeing it said in the suttas.

I might add that the question whether the buddha or arahanths appears nowadays is flawed- they never existed in a concrete sense- you could say 'they' 'existed' as strings of causes and effects which passed on information sequentially. Something manifests some of the causes in a mind now - this image that appears -it is neither belongs to the 'person' seeing it, nor does it belong to anyone else- but the information that this image generates maybe from another string of causes and effects; hope that makes some kind of sense..
With Metta

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Mudita
& Upekkha

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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby rahul » Thu Mar 26, 2009 9:26 pm


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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby pink_trike » Thu Mar 26, 2009 9:45 pm

I'll say this as respectfully as I can: mental illness existed then also. Auditory hallucinations can be caused by something as simple as specific dietary deficiencies, or certain fungus that grows on grains. Even without auditory hallucinations, dreams/visions/messages from the god(s) etc... are often simply elaborate flights of imagination into delusions of grandeur in order to escape looking reality spang in the eye.
Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.

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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby robertk » Fri Mar 27, 2009 5:22 am


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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby clw_uk » Fri Mar 27, 2009 9:47 am

Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken

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srivijaya
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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby srivijaya » Fri Mar 27, 2009 10:08 am

Interesting topic, as I've recently started to read my copy of the Samyutta Nikaya which opens with conversations with Devatas.
I guess the Jhana Buddha is in will affect and enable any communication he has at that level. It would be like 'tuning in' to a different frequency and, thus, being able to 'connect' with beings who dwell there.

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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby rowyourboat » Fri Mar 27, 2009 6:31 pm

modern psychiatry is moving towards the idea that hallucinations are on a spectrum with normality- ie a large portion of the normal population can experience hallucinations without having any mental illness. for example it is quite normal to have hallucinations when falling asleep or waking up, when extremely tired and with sensory deprivation. what is not clear is why a normal mind has such a capacity.
With Metta

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& Upekkha

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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby Cittasanto » Fri Mar 27, 2009 6:44 pm



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby pink_trike » Fri Mar 27, 2009 7:28 pm

Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.

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srivijaya
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Re: Conversations with devas

Postby srivijaya » Fri Mar 27, 2009 9:11 pm



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