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Ariyan aspirations and the lay follower - Page 2 - Dhamma Wheel

Ariyan aspirations and the lay follower

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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retrofuturist
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Re: Ariyan aspirations and the lay follower

Postby retrofuturist » Fri Apr 03, 2009 5:25 am

Greetings Fijinut,

An interesting analogy is that of how fleas in a flea circus are trained.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flea_circus

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

fijiNut
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Re: Ariyan aspirations and the lay follower

Postby fijiNut » Fri Apr 03, 2009 6:42 am


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sukhamanveti
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Re: Ariyan aspirations and the lay follower

Postby sukhamanveti » Fri Apr 03, 2009 3:46 pm

Sīlaṃ balaṃ appaṭimaṃ.
Sīlaṃ āvudhamuttamaṃ.
Sīlamābharaṇaṃ seṭṭhaṃ.
Sīlaṃ kavacamabbhutaṃ.


Virtue is a matchless power.
Virtue is the greatest weapon.
Virtue is the best adornment.
Virtue is a wonderful armor.

Theragatha 614


Sabbapāpassa akaraṇaṃ,
kusalassa upasampadā,
Sacittapariyodapanaṃ,
etaṃ buddhāna sāsanaṃ.


Refraining from all wrong-doing,
Undertaking the good,
Purifying the mind,
This is the teaching of the buddhas.

Dhammapada v. 183/14.5

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Dhammanando
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Re: Ariyan aspirations and the lay follower

Postby Dhammanando » Sat Apr 04, 2009 2:15 pm


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AdvaitaJ
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Re: Ariyan aspirations and the lay follower

Postby AdvaitaJ » Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:24 am

Phil,

Why shouldn't we feel we are more capable than the laity of the Buddha's time? We (most of us, anyway) aren't struggling day in and day out for food and water! Western average life expectancy is what, double what it was in the Buddha's day? (70-something now vs. 30-something then?) Not only do we live twice as long, we have the internet! :woohoo:

So, based purely on the tangible advantages we enjoy, it makes perfect sense to me that we should have higher expectations of ourselves today than the laity of the Buddha's time. Imagine an admittedly optimistic not-too-distant future (say several hundred years), where the average productive life-span is well over one hundred, work/life/spiritual balance is the norm, and the impact of near-immediate global knowledge transfer has had decades to refine and perfect meditation techniques for each individual's fully mapped genome! I would certainly expect someone living in that time to be more capable of greater achievement than we are!

:anjali: AdvaitaJ
The birds have vanished down the sky. Now the last cloud drains away.
We sit together, the mountain and me, until only the mountain remains.
Li Bai

phil
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Re: Ariyan aspirations and the lay follower

Postby phil » Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:36 am

Kammalakkhano , bhikkhave, bālo, kammalakkhano pandito, apadānasobhanī paññāti
(The fool is characterized by his/her actions/the wise one is characterized by his/her actions/Wisdom shines forth in behaviour.)
(AN 3.2 Lakkhana Sutta)

fijiNut
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Re: Ariyan aspirations and the lay follower

Postby fijiNut » Sun Apr 05, 2009 9:40 pm


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Dhammanando
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Re: Ariyan aspirations and the lay follower

Postby Dhammanando » Sun Apr 05, 2009 10:00 pm


fijiNut
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Re: Ariyan aspirations and the lay follower

Postby fijiNut » Sun Apr 05, 2009 10:33 pm

Bhante,
Thank you for your clarification.

:anjali:

kind regards,
fijiNut

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sukhamanveti
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Re: Ariyan aspirations and the lay follower

Postby sukhamanveti » Mon Apr 06, 2009 4:35 am

Sīlaṃ balaṃ appaṭimaṃ.
Sīlaṃ āvudhamuttamaṃ.
Sīlamābharaṇaṃ seṭṭhaṃ.
Sīlaṃ kavacamabbhutaṃ.


Virtue is a matchless power.
Virtue is the greatest weapon.
Virtue is the best adornment.
Virtue is a wonderful armor.

Theragatha 614


Sabbapāpassa akaraṇaṃ,
kusalassa upasampadā,
Sacittapariyodapanaṃ,
etaṃ buddhāna sāsanaṃ.


Refraining from all wrong-doing,
Undertaking the good,
Purifying the mind,
This is the teaching of the buddhas.

Dhammapada v. 183/14.5

rowyourboat
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Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:29 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: Ariyan aspirations and the lay follower

Postby rowyourboat » Sat Apr 11, 2009 8:27 am

Hi Phil,

The teachings of the buddha are of great depth- it is also a gradual path.

There is also the concept of going from what is good, to what is even better in the teachings -to keep improving. ('ujuca sujuca')

So be at a stage which will almost guarantee a good rebirth (sadd, sila, suta, cage, panna). Once you are there and well established in that, you will need a further challenge! Keep improving yourself- only stream entry can gurantee a good rebirth.

Then again going for an extended retreat in Burma, perhaps with Mahasi sayadaw camp or the Pa Uk camp fir 3 months is not beyond reach if we really want it. Sometimes it helps to be in that environment which is optimally geared to motivate us to practice. :anjali:

with metta
With Metta

Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha


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