Just to be clear, I write this thread with no intention of questioning anyone's attainment. That is why specific references are left out for the time being (although they will probably eventually be brought up here and there).
Having attained enlightenment, how would that be reflected in one's constitution?
There are accounts of arahants being rude and otherwise impersonable. These range from the time of the Buddha through to modern times. Wouldn't one with such an attainment have gradually shed certain traits such as impatience, rudeness, etc? What about foul language?
It could be argued that certain attitudes are expressed as a skillful means of teaching a lesson as well, so that might reconcile certain instances of rudeness and the like.
And what to make of smoking?
An Arahant's Constitution
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Re: An Arahant's Constitution
There is an account of Ajahn Chah I have seen somewhere (unverified so please let me know). Someone claiming to have just attained stream-entry came to tell him about it. Ajahn Chah says something along the lines that he supposes the meditator is now much better off than a dog (a fairly harsh insult in Thai, to call someone a dog). Afterwards, the meditator is fuming and leaves. Sotapanna?
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Re: An Arahant's Constitution
Hi
I sent a PM to dhamanando a little while ago about this as he had mentioned an arahant who was complained about du to his manner of speeking.
here is the relevant section of his reply which I am sure he won't mind me sharing here
I sent a PM to dhamanando a little while ago about this as he had mentioned an arahant who was complained about du to his manner of speeking.
here is the relevant section of his reply which I am sure he won't mind me sharing here
as for the Ajahn Chah part to your second post I have heard of Ajahn Chah being rude on several occasions and this one you mention I think is not directly mentioned in one of the Books, but certainly the reflectionsArahant Pilindavaccha, in the Pilindavaccha Sutta of the Udāna. Also given in more detail in the Dhammapada Commentary to Dhp. verse 408. The term of insult was 'vasala', meaning hireling or outcaste.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.
He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
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Re: An Arahant's Constitution
http://web.ukonline.co.uk/buddhism/ariyas4.htm This is a good link to read side by side with this example.SeerObserver wrote:There is an account of Ajahn Chah I have seen somewhere (unverified so please let me know). Someone claiming to have just attained stream-entry came to tell him about it. Ajahn Chah says something along the lines that he supposes the meditator is now much better off than a dog (a fairly harsh insult in Thai, to call someone a dog). Afterwards, the meditator is fuming and leaves. Sotapanna?
I'm pretty sure that's one of the accounts I saw that I was referring to. The label of hireling is familiar. As for the Ajahn Chah example, it is a skillful use of an instance of rudeness.Manapa wrote:I sent a PM to dhamanando a little while ago about this as he had mentioned an arahant who was complained about du to his manner of speeking.
here is the relevant section of his reply which I am sure he won't mind me sharing here
Arahant Pilindavaccha, in the Pilindavaccha Sutta of the Udāna. Also given in more detail in the Dhammapada Commentary to Dhp. verse 408. The term of insult was 'vasala', meaning hireling or outcaste.
as for the Ajahn Chah part to your second post I have heard of Ajahn Chah being rude on several occasions and this one you mention I think is not directly mentioned in one of the Books, but certainly the reflections
Regarding rudeness, it has come to my attention to make the distinction between residual habitual tendencies and defilements. So arahants will not be prone to anger, but may still come off as rude to some.
Re: An Arahant's Constitution
Greetings
As i understand, Anatta isnt about annihilating personality or getting rid of it, its truly understanding it and seeing it for what it is
So therefor an Arahant can still have a distinct personality, its just there is no ignorance in understanding it and so no greed hatred or delusion
Metta
As i understand, Anatta isnt about annihilating personality or getting rid of it, its truly understanding it and seeing it for what it is
So therefor an Arahant can still have a distinct personality, its just there is no ignorance in understanding it and so no greed hatred or delusion
Metta
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”