Under construction - learn Pali reading the suttas

A forum for members who wish to develop a deeper understanding of the Pali Canon and associated Commentaries, which for discussion purposes are both treated as authoritative.

Moderator: Mahavihara moderator

Re: Under construction - learn Pali reading the suttas

Postby Kare » Sun Jul 17, 2011 8:59 am

I find your project commendable. Any project that helps people to read the Pali texts directly, is very useful.

Still, I have to say that I do not really believe in trying to read a Pali text without understanding the grammar. In a highly inflected language, like Pali, the grammar elements make up a very important part of the language. One might say that a Pali word consists of two main elements: the vocabulary element (the first part of the word) and the grammar element or the inflection element (the last part of the word). Both elements are equally important. If we drop out the grammar and only go for the vocabulary elements, we can easily miss the sense of the sentence.

Let me illustrate this with an example in English. Here are the bare vocabulary elements of a short sentence:

boy kill snake

Add some grammatical elements, and we get:

The boy killed the snake
The boys are killing the snake
The boy was killed by the snake
etc.

The meaning of the sentence may change a little, or it may change radically, by adding different grammatical elements.

A beginner might think that it would be helpful to read Pali texts without worrying with the grammar. But sooner or later a reader has to study the grammar if he or she wants to be able to understand the texts. You would never try to read a foreign language without worrying about the vocabulary. The grammar is equally important.
Mettāya,
Kåre
User avatar
Kare
 
Posts: 679
Joined: Sun Feb 01, 2009 10:58 am
Location: Norway

Re: Under construction - learn Pali reading the suttas

Postby Sekha » Sun Jul 17, 2011 1:48 pm

I totally agree

but not everyone is ready to get into Pali grammar, which is quite complex and they can grasp quite a lot working only on semantics. This project here is intended to those who already know they will never understand fully the Pali text, but who would like to get at least some superficial understanding anyway. It's still much better than nothing...

...And, it might inspire those same people to finally get into the grammar...
Where knowledge ends, religion begins. - B. Disraeli

http://www.buddha-vacana.org
User avatar
Sekha
 
Posts: 743
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:32 am
Location: French Guiana

Re: Under construction - learn Pali reading the suttas

Postby Sekha » Mon Jul 25, 2011 7:44 am

there was a mistake previously the index page was in French while I believed I had updated it to English. It is important because it explains the purpose of this work:
http://www.suttapitaka.net

Here are two prototypes of what the suttas will look like:
with word-by-word definitions:
http://www.suttapitaka.net/an03-108.html

with definitions only on selected words:
http://www.suttapitaka.net/an03-109.html

if possible, feedback is appreciated

thank you all
Where knowledge ends, religion begins. - B. Disraeli

http://www.buddha-vacana.org
User avatar
Sekha
 
Posts: 743
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:32 am
Location: French Guiana

Re: Under construction - learn Pali reading the suttas

Postby morning mist » Tue Jul 26, 2011 4:01 am

The definition pop-up is great. It would be easier to know which one has a definition pop-up if they have a different color. That way there is no need to run the cursor over all the words to see which ones have a pop-up. The corresponding English term on the right side that has a pop-up should also be the same color .
with metta,
morning mist
 
Posts: 251
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 3:31 pm

Re: Under construction - learn Pali reading the suttas

Postby Dmytro » Tue Jul 26, 2011 6:19 am

Hi,

Leigh Brasington did a great job:

http://leighb.com/suttas.htm#bilingual
User avatar
Dmytro
 
Posts: 1161
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2009 7:24 pm
Location: Kyiv, Ukraine

Re: Under construction - learn Pali reading the suttas

Postby rowboat » Tue Jul 26, 2011 10:16 am

Very nice work. I've been looking for something just like this, Dukkhanirodha.
Rain soddens what is covered up,
It does not sodden what is open.
Therefore uncover what is covered
That the rain will not sodden it.
Ud 5.5
User avatar
rowboat
 
Posts: 415
Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2010 5:31 am
Location: Brentwood Bay, British Columbia

Re: Under construction - learn Pali reading the suttas

Postby Sekha » Thu Jul 28, 2011 9:00 am

morning mist wrote:The definition pop-up is great. It would be easier to know which one has a definition pop-up if they have a different color. That way there is no need to run the cursor over all the words to see which ones have a pop-up. The corresponding English term on the right side that has a pop-up should also be the same color .

There is a note explaining the words which have a pop are in italic. This might not be obvious enough though. I thought of putting them in bold, but I also thought it hinders the reading of some people.
Where knowledge ends, religion begins. - B. Disraeli

http://www.buddha-vacana.org
User avatar
Sekha
 
Posts: 743
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:32 am
Location: French Guiana

Re: Under construction - learn Pali reading the suttas

Postby Sekha » Thu Jul 28, 2011 9:02 am

Thanks for the feedback. It might go slowly though, since available time to work on this project is getting shorter
Where knowledge ends, religion begins. - B. Disraeli

http://www.buddha-vacana.org
User avatar
Sekha
 
Posts: 743
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:32 am
Location: French Guiana

Re: Under construction - learn Pali reading the suttas

Postby Sekha » Sun Jul 31, 2011 1:30 pm

Here is shallow study of the Jhana formulae:

http://www.suttapitaka.net/formulae.html

Please give some feed back, I will try my best to make it as user friendly as possible for the largest number
Where knowledge ends, religion begins. - B. Disraeli

http://www.buddha-vacana.org
User avatar
Sekha
 
Posts: 743
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:32 am
Location: French Guiana

Re: Under construction - learn Pali reading the suttas

Postby Sekha » Tue Aug 16, 2011 12:23 am

The first version of the website is available.

1) 6 suttas still in beta version have been translated
2) the glossary has about 350 entries with definitions of the words given in the suttas as much as possible. Links to the suttas are still mostly to ATI, but they will be pubished soon on suttapitaka.net
3) there are two sets of Pali formulae already published
4) on the index page, you can like the page on facebook in order to be updated from there.
Where knowledge ends, religion begins. - B. Disraeli

http://www.buddha-vacana.org
User avatar
Sekha
 
Posts: 743
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:32 am
Location: French Guiana

Re: Under construction - learn Pali reading the suttas

Postby gavesako » Tue Aug 16, 2011 9:09 am

This word is always mis-spelt:

compagnonship --> companionship
Bhikkhu Gavesako
Kiṃkusalagavesī anuttaraṃ santivarapadaṃ pariyesamāno... (MN 26)

ajahnchah.org - Teachings of Ajahn Chah in many languages
Dhammatube - Videos on Buddhist practice
Ancient Buddhist Texts - Translations and history of Pali texts
User avatar
gavesako
 
Posts: 1347
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2009 5:16 pm
Location: England

Re: Under construction - learn Pali reading the suttas

Postby Sekha » Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:46 am

just uploaded the Dhammacakkappavattana Sutta:

You will find the definition of each word in a bubble as you put the mouse on it. You have a fair chance to deepen your understanding of the Pali text.

http://www.suttapitaka.net/sutta/samyut ... 6-011.html
Where knowledge ends, religion begins. - B. Disraeli

http://www.buddha-vacana.org
User avatar
Sekha
 
Posts: 743
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:32 am
Location: French Guiana

Previous

Return to Classical Theravāda

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests