Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

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Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby villkorkarma » Mon Jul 25, 2011 5:31 pm

Hello
If one reaches first level of nirvana its a maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana, and then 2 I think, how is it for the highest level of nirvana from the 3 level?
dont hurt anyone in any sort of way
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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby Reductor » Mon Jul 25, 2011 5:49 pm

After sotapanna, first 'nirvana', it is a maximum of 7 lives to complete liberation - nibbana.

From sakadagamin and anagamin, the second and third levels, there is only one life left until attaining nibbana.
Michael

The thoughts I've expressed in the above post are carefully considered and offered in good faith.

And friendliness towards the world is happiness for him who is forbearing with living beings. -- Ud. 2:1
To his own ruin the fool gains knowledge, for it cleaves his head and destroys his innate goodness. -- Dhp 72

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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby manas » Tue Jul 26, 2011 1:13 am

I'm beginning to think that this first level of awakening (sotapanna) is actually a very exalted thing, considering that it leads inexorably to final freedom. What really arouses interest is that there is no reason why any of us cannot attain it in this lifetime, if we make the right kind of effort (so long as we haven't done certain extreme heavy kammas).
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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby villkorkarma » Tue Jul 26, 2011 3:56 pm

hi guys and girls
no no i think you are wrong goenkaji says maximum 7 lives to second level of nirvana, which i think i reached today. and after that 2 more lives to 3 level and then 1 more life
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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby Reductor » Tue Jul 26, 2011 4:22 pm

Then the Blessed One, picking up a little bit of dust with the tip of his fingernail, said to the monks, "What do you think, monks? Which is greater: the little bit of dust I have picked up with the tip of my fingernail, or the great earth?"

"The great earth is far greater, lord. The little bit of dust the Blessed One has picked up with the tip of his fingernail is next to nothing. It's not a hundredth, a thousandth, a one hundred-thousandth — this little bit of dust the Blessed One has picked up with the tip of his fingernail — when compared with the great earth."

"In the same way, monks, for a disciple of the noble ones who is consummate in view, an individual who has broken through [to stream-entry], the suffering & stress totally ended & extinguished is far greater. That which remains in the state of having at most seven remaining lifetimes is next to nothing: it's not a hundredth, a thousandth, a one hundred-thousandth, when compared with the previous mass of suffering. That's how great the benefit is of breaking through to the Dhamma, monks. That's how great the benefit is of obtaining the Dhamma eye."

— SN 13.1


It is nice to have confidence in your teacher, don't forget that your own memory may be mistaken.
Michael

The thoughts I've expressed in the above post are carefully considered and offered in good faith.

And friendliness towards the world is happiness for him who is forbearing with living beings. -- Ud. 2:1
To his own ruin the fool gains knowledge, for it cleaves his head and destroys his innate goodness. -- Dhp 72

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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby Reductor » Tue Jul 26, 2011 4:29 pm

villkorkarma wrote:which i think i reached today.


I would suggest that you NOT hold onto that thought, because either it is, or it is not - holding onto it will only cause trouble for you.
Michael

The thoughts I've expressed in the above post are carefully considered and offered in good faith.

And friendliness towards the world is happiness for him who is forbearing with living beings. -- Ud. 2:1
To his own ruin the fool gains knowledge, for it cleaves his head and destroys his innate goodness. -- Dhp 72

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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby alan » Wed Jul 27, 2011 3:33 am

Does Nirvana have levels? I don't think so.
Not sure what you've been studying, villkor, but it has led you astray.
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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby morning mist » Wed Jul 27, 2011 5:04 am

This is indicating the maximum amount of time, but it doesn't mean that it has to take that long. It really depends on the person also. For example, some became a non-returner or Arahant only a few months after Stream-Entry. It doesn't have to take a person 7 lifetime to become an Arahant after Stream Entry. That is just the longest or (((((maximum)))))) amount of time after Stream-Entry. When we look at Kondanna ( one of the first 5 Arahants) we see that he reached Stream Entry after the first Sermon. A few weeks or months later he became an Arahant in this very life. But that is not to say that others won't take longer, say a few lifetimes. If the person is a Stream Enterer already, then the (((longest)) it would take is 7 lives. It depends on a person's skillful effort, etc...
with metta,
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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby Ben » Wed Jul 27, 2011 6:41 am

villkorkarma wrote:hi guys and girls
no no i think you are wrong goenkaji says maximum 7 lives to second level of nirvana,

That's certainly not my recollection. Perhaps you can provide evidence?

villkorkarma wrote:which i think i reached today.

Seriously, I don't think so.
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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby Mawkish1983 » Wed Jul 27, 2011 1:16 pm

I prefered the pre-edit version, Ben. One's reaction to the choice of words in it would have proven most illuminating too, if one cares to see what is illuminated.
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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby Ben » Wed Jul 27, 2011 1:23 pm

Thanks Keith!
I certainly wasn't expecting your reaction. And thank you!
I decided to self-censor for a number of reasons.
Perhaps a more gentle approach might encourage villkorkamma to develop another perspective.
kind regards

Ben
"One cannot step twice into the same river, nor can one grasp any mortal substance in a stable condition, but it scatters and again gathers; it forms and dissolves, and approaches and departs."

- Hereclitus


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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby villkorkarma » Wed Aug 03, 2011 7:25 pm

iam courios about the sources of your saying about first nirvana then 7 lives to freedom.
goenkaji , i think he has studied the palicanon.
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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby villkorkarma » Wed Aug 03, 2011 7:29 pm

and I think that all of us have to go through the same effort of suffering before we reach final freedom.
the forgiveness doesnt has to be perfect, it was something gary r renard heard from 2 masters from the freedomheaven that camed and visited him 17 times,
and spoked about forgiveness in the book out of space. im from sweden but you know the writer right. they also sayed that when you work more with the forgiveness,
you will see more and more through the illusion that we all are the christ.
dont hurt anyone in any sort of way
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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby mikenz66 » Wed Aug 03, 2011 8:02 pm

Villkorkarma

It's not clear to me what you are trying to discuss. The standard interpretation, along with sutta references, is here:
http://what-buddha-said.net/library/Bud ... ya-puggala

:anjali:
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Re: Maximum of 7 lives to the next level of nirvana.

Postby robertk » Thu Aug 04, 2011 3:09 am

villkorkarma wrote:hi guys and girls
no no i think you are wrong goenkaji says maximum 7 lives to second level of nirvana, which i think i reached today. and after that 2 more lives to 3 level and then 1 more life

Oh hilarious, Thanks for that.
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