Upadana as "sustenance"

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Upadana as "sustenance"

Postby retrofuturist » Thu Sep 08, 2011 2:30 am

Greetings,

I've observed in Thanissaro Bhikkhu's translations, such as...

SN 12.52: Upadana Sutta
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html

... that he translates upadana doubly as "clinging/sustenance".

He also seems to translate the Pali compound panca-upadana-khanda as... "clingable phenomena (or: phenomena that offer sustenance = the five aggregates)"

Clinging tends to be a more common translation than sustenance, but I was wondering what people thought of the use (or implication) of sustenance as a possible translation of upadana.

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Retro. :)
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Re: Upadana as "sustenance"

Postby Ben » Thu Sep 08, 2011 2:35 am

Greetings Retro,
It reminds me of a translation I once read, sorry I don't have a reference with me at the moment, of the five khandhas being five heaps (on fire). So, sustenance would fit in well in that regard.
kind regards

Ben
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saṇantā yanti kusobbhā,
tuṇhīyanti mahodadhī.

Sutta Nipata 3.725

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Re: Upadana as "sustenance"

Postby Dmytro » Fri Sep 09, 2011 8:04 am

Greetings Retro,

retrofuturist wrote:... that he translates upadana doubly as "clinging/sustenance".

He also seems to translate the Pali compound panca-upadana-khanda as... "clingable phenomena (or: phenomena that offer sustenance = the five aggregates)"

Clinging tends to be a more common translation than sustenance, but I was wondering what people thought of the use (or implication) of sustenance as a possible translation of upadana.


He evidently follows the secondary meaning of the word 'upadana', which IMO is not appropriate in this context:

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=6867&p=109444#p109444

Best wishes, Dmytro

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Re: Upadana as "sustenance"

Postby PeterB » Fri Sep 09, 2011 8:13 am

I am certainly no " Pali Wallah" but it does seem to me that the translation of Upadana is better rendered as "appropriation " rather than as "clinging". It seems to me that this obsession with clinging is not always helpful..there is, or so it seems, a view that there is a clinger.
The idea of a cluster of khandic activity which draws in temporary "sustenance " seems much more apropos.


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