is love of life metta?

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby befriend » Fri Oct 14, 2011 11:57 am

daverupa wrote:
acinteyyo wrote:
dhamma follower wrote:How do you define life as you experience it?

Seeing, hearing, smelling, tasting, touching, thinking/feeling/imagining...?

Is any of these is permanent, satisfactory, commandable?

Best wishes,

excellent answer! :goodpost:
this should be kept in mind and considered well...


Sadhu! Sadhu!



yes i do define life as such. is it not a deep joy to see the world like this???????????????? metta befriend :woohoo:

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby Fede » Fri Oct 14, 2011 11:59 am

Guy wrote:Hi Befriend,

When people say they "love life", do you think they love all aspects of life or just the pleasant parts?

Do you think that people who claim to "love life" also love: loss, disappointment, pain, grief, despair, sorrow, lamentation, old age, sickness and death?

Metta,

Guy


I can honestly answer yes, but I think, as far as I am concerned, I am content from a PoV, to substitute the word 'Love' for 'Embrace'.

What other choice do we have?
"Samsara: The human condition's heartbreaking inability to sustain contentment." Elizabeth Gilbert, 'Eat, Pray, Love'.

Simplify: 17 into 1 WILL go: Mindfulness!

Quieta movere magna merces videbatur. (Sallust, c.86-c.35 BC)
Translation: Just to stir things up seemed a good reward in itself. ;)

I am sooooo happy - How on earth could I be otherwise?! :D


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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby daverupa » Fri Oct 14, 2011 12:02 pm

Fede wrote:I can honestly answer yes, but I think, as far as I am concerned, I am content from a PoV, to substitute the word 'Love' for 'Embrace'.

What other choice do we have?


Upekkha.
    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.
- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby befriend » Fri Oct 14, 2011 12:09 pm

had an idea, maybe its impossible to love life. becaue there is no self. who is loving life????????????????? yes yes, what do you think?

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby Fede » Fri Oct 14, 2011 12:31 pm

daverupa wrote:
Fede wrote:I can honestly answer yes, but I think, as far as I am concerned, I am content from a PoV, to substitute the word 'Love' for 'Embrace'.

What other choice do we have?


Upekkha.

Precisely.

Latin aequanimitas, from aequo animo with even mind.


Meeting with Triumph or Disaster, and treating those impostors just the same.
"Samsara: The human condition's heartbreaking inability to sustain contentment." Elizabeth Gilbert, 'Eat, Pray, Love'.

Simplify: 17 into 1 WILL go: Mindfulness!

Quieta movere magna merces videbatur. (Sallust, c.86-c.35 BC)
Translation: Just to stir things up seemed a good reward in itself. ;)

I am sooooo happy - How on earth could I be otherwise?! :D


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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby daverupa » Fri Oct 14, 2011 1:34 pm

This earlier thread also discusses upekkha in some detail, on that note, but alas this begins to go further afield than the OP.
    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.
- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby befriend » Fri Oct 14, 2011 1:47 pm

daverupa i am wondering what you think of. loving life being a form of identifying with ones sensations as being yours. if sensations arent mine, its impossible to love life because life is like a dream. but that is ultamite reality, in conventional reality it may be a different story.....?

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby dhamma follower » Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:28 pm

befriend wrote:had an idea, maybe its impossible to love life. becaue there is no self. who is loving life????????????????? yes yes, what do you think?


Hi befriend,

It is not so!

There's no need for a self in order for "love for life" to exist.

Although there is no self, there is a mental factor called craving having as object the concept of life, this craving is "love for life ". It is craving, not you, me or anybody else.

To understand correctly conventional and ultimate reality, and apply them appropriately in your understanding of the phenomenal world, you might try to read some basic works about the Abhidhamma.

This is one option:
http://www.usamyanmar.net/Buddha/Book/A ... 0Print.pdf

In line with your enquiry about what is the foundation for higher states of mind and wisdom, you might study further about the sobhana cetasikas (beautiful mental factors) and the 6 particulars. You will also see that pity (joy) and sukha (happiness) are among the mental factors of the first jhanna, which can be a foundation for vipassana insight. However, these mental factors of joy and happiness arise as a result of strong one-pointedness of mind, they don't have the sense objects as object. Therefore, they are not to be confused with our joy and happiness in daily life, which have some degree of craving in it. It is important to well understand the differences between these mental factors.

Best wishes,

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby dhamma follower » Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:35 pm

befriend wrote:daverupa i am wondering what you think of. loving life being a form of identifying with ones sensations as being yours. if sensations arent mine, its impossible to love life because life is like a dream. but that is ultamite reality, in conventional reality it may be a different story.....?


Life (with people, houses, jobs, lovers...) IS a dream, dear friend :-)
Yet we forget it most of the time :cry:

Best wishes,

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby befriend » Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:43 pm

excellent, yeah i need to study the abhidhamma more. puja, befriend.

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby ground » Fri Oct 14, 2011 4:15 pm

befriend wrote:i think people who hate life, and do not enjoy just being themselves, and being alive. they are not so compassionate.


Ordinary consciousness is obsessed with the thought "life" as it is obsessed with the thought "compassion" when actually what is referred to with the term "compassion" is feeling. So attachment to feeling and attachment to "life" (existence) go hand in hand.
Also ordinary consciousness only knows like ("love") and dislike ("hate").


Kind regards

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby Guy » Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:53 pm

Hi Befriend and Fede,

Thank you both for your replies.

In my experience, it is possible to embrace the unpleasant and the pleasant without desire or aversion sometimes, but, it seems another matter entirely to embrace all experience all the time with equanimity.

I cannot honestly say that I love/embrace/accept all of life equally. My understand is that such a pure mental state would only be sustainable indefinitely by an Arahant? Maybe I am wrong about this.

Metta,

Guy
Four types of letting go:

1) Giving; expecting nothing back in return
2) Throwing things away
3) Contentment; wanting to be here, not wanting to be anywhere else
4) "Teflon Mind"; having a mind which doesn't accumulate things

- Ajahn Brahm

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby Ben » Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:57 pm

Guy wrote:Hi Befriend and Fede,

Thank you both for your replies.

In my experience, it is possible to embrace the unpleasant and the pleasant without desire or aversion sometimes, but, it seems another matter entirely to embrace all experience all the time with equanimity.

I cannot honestly say that I love/embrace/accept all of life equally. My understand is that such a pure mental state would only be sustainable indefinitely by an Arahant? Maybe I am wrong about this.

Metta,

Guy


Keep practicing Guy and little by little you will approach the goal. In the meantime an artefact of practice, increased equanimity, will make its presence felt through every aspect of life.
All the best,

Ben
Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.

Taṃ nadīhi vijānātha:
sobbhesu padaresu ca,
saṇantā yanti kusobbhā,
tuṇhīyanti mahodadhī.

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby Guy » Fri Oct 14, 2011 11:36 pm

Thank you Ben, "slow and steady wins the race", right? :anjali:
Four types of letting go:

1) Giving; expecting nothing back in return
2) Throwing things away
3) Contentment; wanting to be here, not wanting to be anywhere else
4) "Teflon Mind"; having a mind which doesn't accumulate things

- Ajahn Brahm

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby Ben » Fri Oct 14, 2011 11:41 pm

Guy wrote:Thank you Ben, "slow and steady wins the race", right? :anjali:


Indeed! One step in front of the other. That is all one need do to walk this path.
Step-by-step, step-by-step.
with Metta,
Ben
Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.

Taṃ nadīhi vijānātha:
sobbhesu padaresu ca,
saṇantā yanti kusobbhā,
tuṇhīyanti mahodadhī.

Sutta Nipata 3.725

Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR
Buddhist Life Stories of Australia
e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby bodom » Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:02 am

Ben wrote:
Guy wrote:Thank you Ben, "slow and steady wins the race", right? :anjali:


Indeed! One step in front of the other. That is all one need do to walk this path.
Step-by-step, step-by-step.
with Metta,
Ben



One by one, little by little, moment by moment, a wise man should remove his own impurities, as a smith removes his dross from silver. - Dhp 239

:anjali:
The heart of the path is SO simple. No need for long explanations. Give up clinging to love and hate, just rest with things as they are. That is all I do in my own practice. Do not try to become anything. Do not make yourself into anything. Do not be a meditator. Do not become enlightened. When you sit, let it be. When you walk, let it be. Grasp at nothing. Resist nothing. Of course, there are dozens of meditation techniques to develop samadhi and many kinds of vipassana. But it all comes back to this - just let it all be. Step over here where it is cool, out of the battle. - Ajahn Chah

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby Guy » Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:58 am

Thanks Ben! :anjali:

Thanks Bodom! :anjali:

Most of all, thanks Buddha! :anjali: :bow: :anjali: :bow: :anjali: :bow:
Four types of letting go:

1) Giving; expecting nothing back in return
2) Throwing things away
3) Contentment; wanting to be here, not wanting to be anywhere else
4) "Teflon Mind"; having a mind which doesn't accumulate things

- Ajahn Brahm

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby socoguy78 » Mon Oct 08, 2012 3:21 pm

befriend wrote:hi,
this is probably a stupid question but i am wondering. is thinking thoughts about how you love life, is this a form of loving kindness. there is defenitely love involved, affection for existence and the special way humans experience reality. but life isnt exactly a sentient being. can i have metta for compassion. most of us here love compassion rejoice in its glory but is that love for compassion considered metta? thanks, befriend. :anjali:



Dhamma Greetings!
There are never stupid questions... that is how we learn. Never be hard on yourself. I would have to say no that thinking thoughts about how you love life is Metta (loving-kindness). If you want to bring up the feeling of Metta... Try this. Remember back in your past of a happy joyful time. It could be a birthday, a birth, a proud moment of doing awesome in school. Anything it can be as long as it is a happy joyful memory. When you remember that memory I want you to let that memory go and keep remembering that happy joyful feeling and keep your minds attention that that feeling. You will start to feel a warm fuzzy feeling in the center of your chest radiating. That is the feeling of Metta. If you want to use it as a meditation object you will be following the brahma viharas (the 4 godly abodes) with metta as the first feeling. As you progress the feeling changes into compassion, then joy, and finnaly the best of all... equinimity where your mind will not shake at anything! BTW Equinimity is one of the Enlightenment Factors. There is a lot I left out... because it needs to be experienced and not thought about. If you keep thinking about it... the feeling is not going to come up... There will be an attatchment to it. We can't force the feeling to come, so just sit and let it be with out making it or forcing it, or thinking about it. Let the cognitive side of the mind go... and just feel that happy joyful feeling from a memory(let the memory go and don't think about it when you remember the happy joyful feeling) and place your minds attention on that happy joyful feeling.

Much Maha Metta!
Zach

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby Maarten » Mon Oct 08, 2012 7:44 pm

If you practise metta meditation, watch the feeling you generate for all the beings out there. Then compare this feeling to what you call love of life and you have your answer. ;)

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Re: is love of life metta?

Postby theY » Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:01 am

See bold text, all see all in my link for advance information.

[Characteristic, Etc.]

93. As to the characteristic, etc., loving-kindness is characterized here as
promoting the aspect of welfare. Its function is to prefer welfare. It is manifested
as the removal of annoyance. Its proximate cause is seeing loveableness in beings.
It succeeds when it makes ill will subside, and it fails when it produces (selfish)
affection.


94. Compassion is characterized as promoting the aspect of allaying suffering.
Its function resides in not bearing others’ suffering. It is manifested as non-
cruelty. Its proximate cause is to see helplessness in those overwhelmed by
suffering. It succeeds when it makes cruelty subside and it fails when it produces
sorrow.

95. Gladness is characterized as gladdening (produced by others’ success).12
Its function resides in being unenvious. It is manifested as the elimination of
aversion (boredom). Its proximate cause is seeing beings, success. It succeeds
when it makes aversion (boredom) subside, and it fails when it produces
merriment.

96. Equanimity is characterized as promoting the aspect of neutrality towards
beings. Its function is to see equality in beings. It is manifested as the quieting of
resentment and approval. Its proximate cause is seeing ownership of deeds
(kamma) thus: “Beings are owners of their deeds. Whose13 [if not theirs] is the
choice by which they will become happy, or will get free from suffering, or will
not fall away from the success they have reached?” It succeeds when it makes
resentment and approval subside, and it fails when it produces the equanimity
of unknowing, which is that [worldly-minded indifference of ignorance] based
on the house life.

[Purpose]

97. The general purpose of these four divine abidings is the bliss of insight
and an excellent [form of future] existence. That peculiar to each is respectively
the warding off of ill will, and so on. For here loving-kindness has the purpose
of warding off ill will, while the others have the respective purposes of warding
off cruelty, aversion (boredom), and greed or resentment. And this is said too:
“For this is the escape from ill will, friends, that is to say, the mind-deliverance of
loving-kindness ... For this is the escape from cruelty, friends, that is to say, the
mind-deliverance of compassion ... For this is the escape from boredom, friends,
that is to say, the mind-deliverance of gladness ... For this is the escape from
greed, friends, that is to say, the mind-deliverance of equanimity” (D III 248).

[The Near and Far Enemies]

98. And here each one has two enemies, one near and one far.
The divine abiding of loving-kindness [319] has greed as its near enemy,14
since both share in seeing virtues. Greed behaves like a foe who keeps close by a
man, and it easily finds an opportunity. So loving-kindness should be well
protected from it. And ill will, which is dissimilar to the similar greed, is its far
enemy like a foe ensconced in a rock wilderness. So loving-kindness must be
practiced free from fear of that; for it is not possible to practice loving-kindness
and feel anger simultaneously (see D III 247–48).


99. Compassion has grief based on the home life as its near enemy, since both
share in seeing failure. Such grief has been described in the way beginning,
“When a man either regards as a privation failure to obtain visible objects
cognizable by the eye that are sought after, desired, agreeable, gratifying and
associated with worldliness, or when he recalls those formerly obtained that are
past, ceased and changed, then grief arises in him. Such grief as this is called
grief based on the home life” (M III 218). And cruelty, which is dissimilar to the
similar grief, is its far enemy. So compassion must be practiced free from fear of
that; for it is not possible to practice compassion and be cruel to breathing things
simultaneously.

100. Gladness has joy based on the home life as its near enemy, since both share
in seeing success. Such joy has been described in the way beginning, “When a
man either regards as gain the obtaining of visible objects cognizable by the eye
that are sought ... and associated with worldliness, or recalls those formerly
obtained that are past, ceased, and changed, then joy arises in him. Such joy as
this is called joy based on the home life” (M III 217). And aversion (boredom),
which is dissimilar to the similar joy, is its far enemy. So gladness should be
practiced free from fear of that; for it is not possible to practice gladness and be
discontented with remote abodes and things connected with the higher
profitableness simultaneously.

101. Equanimity has the equanimity of unknowing based on the home life as
its near enemy, since both share in ignoring faults and virtues. Such unknowing
has been described in the way beginning, “On seeing a visible object with the
eye equanimity arises in the foolish infatuated ordinary man, in the untaught
ordinary man who has not conquered his limitations, who has not conquered
future [kamma] result, who is unperceiving of danger. Such equanimity as this
does not surmount the visible object. Such equanimity as this is called equanimity
based on the home life” (M III 219). And greed and resentment, which are
dissimilar to the similar unknowing, are its far enemies. Therefore equanimity
must be practiced free from fear of that; [320] for it is not possible to look on with
equanimity and be inflamed with greed or be resentful15 simultaneously.

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Number 93, end of current page: http://books.google.co.th/books?id=B_UW ... &q&f=false
Lesson Relationship of Abhidhammatthasaṅgaha (10/31/2012)
http://tipitakanews.org/en/node/61


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