Stream-Entry and Hindrance of Doubt

Exploring the Dhamma, as understood from the perspective of the ancient Pali commentaries.
Post Reply
beoman
Posts: 4
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 6:25 pm

Stream-Entry and Hindrance of Doubt

Post by beoman »

The second fetter is doubt (vicikiccha). The fifth hindrance is doubt (vicikiccha). Does this mean that a stream-enterer no longer experiences the fetter of doubt, whatsoever, in any form?
User avatar
cooran
Posts: 8503
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2009 11:32 pm
Location: Queensland, Australia

Re: Stream-Entry and Hindrance of Doubt

Post by cooran »

Hello beoman,

Here are some suttas and teachings on Stream Entry –
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/index-su ... tml#stream" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

including why uncertainty doesn’t arise
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

with metta
Chris
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---
User avatar
reflection
Posts: 1116
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2011 9:27 pm

Re: Stream-Entry and Hindrance of Doubt

Post by reflection »

Hi!

Interesting question.

The second fetter is also translated as "skepticism" or I would say "doubt about the dhamma". Because a stream enterer directly has seen the no-self, there would be no doubt about the words of the Buddha anymore. However, doubt about other things -like ones own capacities- are not included in this and can than still arise. By this reasoning, I don't think a SE has removed one of the 5 hindrances in meditation forever.

:namaste:
Reflection
chownah
Posts: 9336
Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:19 pm

Re: Stream-Entry and Hindrance of Doubt

Post by chownah »

I guess that a stream enterer might have some doubt about whether this or that translation of what the Buddha taught was correct or not. Since there are at least two translations and interpretations for every teaching and if a stream enterer couldn't doubt one of them then she would have to accept both of them and that seems sort of untenable....I guess....

Could it be that having faith in the Buddha had a different meaning when he was still alive and directly accessable and that now we need to work a bit harder at finding the meaning of "faith in the Buddha" or even "faith in the teachings of the Buddha" today?
chownah
User avatar
Cittasanto
Posts: 6646
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:31 pm
Location: Ellan Vannin
Contact:

Re: Stream-Entry and Hindrance of Doubt

Post by Cittasanto »

I remember readin Thanissaro Bhikkhus study guide on streementry, it was very interesting, but he links this to Kamma and its workings.

one may not understand Kamma in all its nuances but they trust the principles, the path & fruit etc because they hold right view.

I found this useful
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
beoman
Posts: 4
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 6:25 pm

Re: Stream-Entry and Hindrance of Doubt

Post by beoman »

cooran wrote:including why uncertainty doesn’t arise
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
That seems to be more about Arahants than Stream-Enterers. Arahants have
ended all views; stream-enterers, only personality-belief-views, no?
User avatar
cooran
Posts: 8503
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2009 11:32 pm
Location: Queensland, Australia

Re: Stream-Entry and Hindrance of Doubt

Post by cooran »

Hello beoman, all,

This table may be helpful for you:

Qualities of Ariya Persons
http://www.thisismyanmar.com/nibbana/ariyas4.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

with metta
Chris
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---
Post Reply