YOU CANNOT POST. OUR WEB HOSTING COMPANY DECIDED TO MOVE THE SERVER TO ANOTHER LOCATION. IN THE MEANTIME, YOU CAN VIEW THIS VERSION WHICH DOES NOT ALLOW POSTING AND WILL NOT SAVE ANYTHING YOU DO ONCE THE OTHER SERVER GOES ONLINE.

(The failure to) Go West - Page 2 - Dhamma Wheel

(The failure to) Go West

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
User avatar
Mexicali
Posts: 59
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 9:12 pm

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby Mexicali » Thu Apr 30, 2009 2:28 pm

Individual

Not that Christians and Muslims with swords haven't had an impact on Buddhist historically, but it doesn't work to explain completely why Buddhism didn't spread west. It had about 300-400 years before Christianity even appeared to get rolling (depending on whose estimate of the Buddha's life we believe), and a couple more centuries before Christianity became a paying concern, then a couple more centuries until Islam appeared on the scene. Why didn't mostly-Pagan Eurasia embrace Buddhism? Islam may have decimated Buddhism in India, Afghanistan, etc, but it can't explain why it never seemed to take hold west of there in the first place.

Dmytro

Thanks for the link but I meant that an actual monarch of Greece proper is mentioned as a convert at one point, as opposed to one of the Greco-Asians. The Greek influence is obvious in a lot of early Buddhist art though.
"We do not embrace reason at the expense of emotion. We embrace it at the expense of self-deception."
-- Herbert Muschamp

User avatar
Ngawang Drolma.
Posts: 805
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:38 pm

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby Ngawang Drolma. » Thu Apr 30, 2009 3:37 pm



Individual
Posts: 1970
Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:19 am

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby Individual » Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:12 pm

The best things in life aren't things.


User avatar
jcsuperstar
Posts: 1915
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 5:15 am
Location: alaska
Contact:

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby jcsuperstar » Fri May 01, 2009 2:57 am

there was probably no reason for it to take hold in the west. religion in the past seems to have been more more um, practical(?) , if things were going well then the gods are real and we're doing it right, but if someone takes over the empire or whatever then their gods must be more powerful etc. religions in the past seem to work top down; whatever the ruling class is doing spreads.
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

Individual
Posts: 1970
Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:19 am

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby Individual » Fri May 01, 2009 4:36 am

Also, considering the existence of Buddhist shrines in Afghanistan, until they were destroyed by the Taliban, Buddhists did make their way westward... Not very effectively, though, because there have been zealots historically, like the Taliban, that wiped them out and destroyed whatever they built, so they had to retreat eastward.
The best things in life aren't things.


User avatar
Dan74
Posts: 3012
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2009 11:12 pm

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby Dan74 » Fri May 01, 2009 5:20 am

From the very little reading that I've done the above does not accord with historical evidence. The reasons for the Dharma's failure to spread were a lot more complex than a supposedly militant attitude of Christians and Muslims.

There is some relevant discussion here:



_/|\_
_/|\_

floating_abu
Posts: 94
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2009 8:50 pm

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby floating_abu » Fri May 01, 2009 12:44 pm


User avatar
pink_trike
Posts: 1130
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:29 am
Contact:

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby pink_trike » Thu May 07, 2009 5:15 am

Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.

User avatar
pink_trike
Posts: 1130
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:29 am
Contact:

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby pink_trike » Thu May 07, 2009 5:32 am

Last edited by pink_trike on Fri May 08, 2009 2:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.

User avatar
Ngawang Drolma.
Posts: 805
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:38 pm

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby Ngawang Drolma. » Thu May 07, 2009 4:51 pm



User avatar
pink_trike
Posts: 1130
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:29 am
Contact:

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby pink_trike » Thu May 07, 2009 5:56 pm

Last edited by pink_trike on Thu May 07, 2009 6:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.

User avatar
Ngawang Drolma.
Posts: 805
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:38 pm

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby Ngawang Drolma. » Thu May 07, 2009 6:40 pm

Hi Pink_Trike,

Although I'm not sure I agree with you about where to place the responsibility, I definitely agree that religion can be powerful medicine. And it should be dispensed carefully. In the wrong hands it's easy for disasters to happen, as you so aptly pointed out. It's strange where we've gone with this in the US. George Dubya used to talk publicly about his experiences of god talking to him :rolleye:

Best,
Drolma


User avatar
pink_trike
Posts: 1130
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:29 am
Contact:

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby pink_trike » Thu May 07, 2009 6:43 pm

Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.

User avatar
Ngawang Drolma.
Posts: 805
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:38 pm

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby Ngawang Drolma. » Thu May 07, 2009 7:06 pm

It freaks me out a little. I joined the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster because they actively petition the teaching of Intelligent Design in schools (outside of World Religion class). I think the thing that bothered me the most about George Dubya and his conversations with god is that nobody questioned it much. Comedians and late night show hosts should have been slapping that down silly. And Sarah Palin wanted Creationism taught in public schools, yet no one seemed too concerned about that. They were more concerned with how much she was paying for her wardrobe. What about those of us for whom Christianity isn't compatible? Or our children?

Image


User avatar
clw_uk
Posts: 4655
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 2:36 am

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby clw_uk » Thu May 07, 2009 7:36 pm

And which creationist speculaitve myth to teach, christian? Hindu? Shinto? ancient greek? Egyptian religion?
Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken

User avatar
pink_trike
Posts: 1130
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:29 am
Contact:

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby pink_trike » Thu May 07, 2009 7:51 pm

Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.

User avatar
Ngawang Drolma.
Posts: 805
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:38 pm

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby Ngawang Drolma. » Thu May 07, 2009 8:10 pm

That's a very interesting statistic, Pink_Trike.

:anjali:


vitellius
Posts: 190
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 3:21 pm

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby vitellius » Sun May 10, 2009 9:47 am

Here is a research on similarities in Greek philosophy and Indian yoga (in broad sense):
The Shape of Ancient Thought: Comparative Studies in Greek and Indian Philosophies
http://books.google.com/books?id=Vpqr1v ... frontcover

To my opinion some similarities presented in this book are just similarities, but there is also some evidence of borrowing.

It seems that at least part of Greek philosophy was what in India would be called "yoga" - or "personal development" and "self-improvement" in modern times. Pyrrho(nism), Stoicism, Cynicism, Epicureanism, (Neo)platonism - all these included ethical systems (sometimes involving asceticism) and mental training aimed at reaching dispassionateness and happiness. If not inspired by, these philosophies were at least influenced by Indian samana teachings, - probably including early Buddhism.

termite
Posts: 31
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 12:36 am

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby termite » Sun May 10, 2009 6:06 pm


User avatar
Dan74
Posts: 3012
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2009 11:12 pm

Re: (The failure to) Go West

Postby Dan74 » Tue May 12, 2009 12:20 am

_/|\_


Return to “Connections to Other Paths”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 24 guests

Google Saffron, Theravada Search Engine