Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

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Ceisiwr
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by Ceisiwr »

flyingOx wrote:One other thing before I go on to completely devote the rest of my day to studying physics: A council of elders were sitting in a circle working out perceptive views with one another so to be able to communicate in a more clear, precise, and understandable way. Along comes a few others and someone new who just happened to be wandering around by himself walks through the village. He hears the late comers to the council talking about things that he is familiar with, so he joins the conversation by saying what he knows. One of the late comers to the council meeting said, “we don’t know you. Where did you come from? And why are you butting in where you don’t belong?” The wanderer said, “I’m sorry, I didn’t mean to offend you. Did I say something the wrong way?” I ask you three questions:

First, why do the elders have a council when they could easily use their great wisdom to say whatever they needed to say perfectly clear for all to understand the first time that they heard it?

Second, who has the most noble attitude, the stranger, or the late comers to the elder’s council?

Third, why are they late?
Is this supposed to be a Zen Koan or a question (or riddle) that has a logical answer?

Metta
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
flyingOx
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by flyingOx »

clw_uk wrote:Hey
Second of all, it is not so much a worry as much as it is not wanting to look religious at a school that I will be going to for the next few semesters.
So you dont want (which is craving, something thats abandoned at nibbana)

to look religious (worrying about your self image, which is self view or conciet, which is another thing abandoned when reaching nibbana)

Third, I have already found the answer to my own question if you have been reading my words rather than trying to see what kind of debate you can coax me into.

Im not trying to coax you into a debate :smile: , im just trying to show you that care needs to be taken when assessing ones progress along the path, a liberating experience (which im sure you have had) is not nescicarily THE liberation. Im not down playing your experience, but dont be fooled into thinking your enlightened when you might not be, this just leads to more dukkha (suffering)
sankhara and jati
Sankhara has many meanings, from Ajahn Buddhadasa
I would like to take this opportunity to discuss all the meanings of the term "sankhara." This is a very common and important word in the Pali scriptures, but many people have problems with it due to its different uses and meanings. Languages are like that, uncertain and seemingly unreliable. The single word "sankhara" can mean "conditioner," the cause that conditions; it can mean "condition," the result of the action of conditioning; and it can mean "'conditioning," the activity or process of conditioning. We use the same word for the subject of the conditioning, "the concocter," as well as the object, "the concoction." We even use it for the activity, "the concocting," itself. This may be a bit confusing for you, so please remember that "sankhara" has three meanings. The correct meaning depends on the context. This knowledge will be valuable in your further studies.
jati means birth

Metta
There are several reasons to not look very religious right now besides how people will see me for my sake. Believe me, I am not the kind of person who cares how people see me. I never was. Even when things weren’t going this good for me. It’s mostly because of time, but also because religion turns most people off. I sure don’t want my friends to end up somewhere with a bunch of religious lawyers probing them incessantly. I don’t think that kind of thing is necessary and it isn’t very loving.

Well, I’m glad that you aren’t trying to probe me like some alien with a stick. Sticks can snap, you know.
One is encouraged to seek the truth, but be warned if you ever find it, you will be treated as blasphemous.
flyingOx
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by flyingOx »

TheDhamma wrote:Hi FlyingOx,

I assume you are talking about the factors of enlightenment and the book, Wings to Awakening by Thanissaro Bhikkhu?

What is your opinion of the nature of nibbana, after feeling that you have had some break-through and considering that you have read Thanissaro Bhikkhu's works? Have you read his other works, such as The Mind like fire Unbound?
Sorry, I didn't answer all of your questions earlier and was being silly.

Wings to Awakening is the only one that I have read by Thanissaro Bhikkhu. I have studied many other books and have done much meditation for many years on my own, though. So much has been done throughout the years already to prepare for this last book that I read. It really isn't like it just happened over night, but Wings to Awakening helped me get a breakthrough.

As far as nibbana goes:

Nirvana

eternal vanishing
long lost friend
eternal vanishing
how long has it been
eternal vanishing
on you I depend
eternal vanishing
long lost friend
just then I did not see you
until my eyes could transcend
eternal vanishing
I empty myself to you
eternal vanishing
I will not lose you
eternal vanishing

I’m in

flyingOx
One is encouraged to seek the truth, but be warned if you ever find it, you will be treated as blasphemous.
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Ngawang Drolma.
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by Ngawang Drolma. »

Hi friend,

I mean this only to be helpful, not to make you feel uncomfortable. I'm going to share a personal story.

When I first started meditating, I found a "void" kind of quickly. It was blissful! An hour could pass and it only felt like a couple of minutes (at the most) to me. In that void nothing existed, including me. I believe I was getting what could be called "emptiness sickness." Emptiness sickness can mean other things as well. Eventually I preferred meditating to anything or anyone, and I preferred to be doing meditating over anything else. In fact I became sort of addicted. But I recovered from the emptiness sickness.

For me, connecting with a teacher proved to be a huge help. And I was able to continue to meditate (and learned some very good practices) but I was much more grounded. Now I'm not saying that what happened with me is happening to you. I'm just sharing a story.

The value of spiritual friends is tremendous for anyone! As the Buddha told Ananda, "they are the whole of spiritual life!" So having a spiritual friend or guide to evaluate our progress is invaluable. Even people with accomplishments have been known to have teachers, so maybe you would like having one too. Please let us know if we can help you find a person to connect with in your area.

Best wishes,
Drolma
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Mexicali
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by Mexicali »

If you think you're an awakened being whose aura is healing people, I think it's very possible you may want to seek psychiatric help. This is not meant as an insult; such claims in my experience have often preceded delusions of grandeur and breakdowns.
"We do not embrace reason at the expense of emotion. We embrace it at the expense of self-deception."
-- Herbert Muschamp
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DNS
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by DNS »

Hi FlyingOx,

Interesting poem. I notice you used the word "eternal" about 7 times. Do you know that there is a little controversy over some of Thanissaro Bhikkhu's works? Some have found his teachings to be bordering on eternalism. That is why I asked your opinion of nibbana as I wanted to see you much you may have been led or misled (whichever the case may be) by his writings.

We live in the current dispensation of Gotama Buddha. Fortunately for us, there is no need to go at it alone. You can find a teacher as others have mentioned to help guide you. There is no need to go off into the wilderness on your own and meditate by yourself without any guidance. Certainly there are some monks who go off to a cave or lonely place for extended times, even years, but it is always after some good guidance from a teacher and / or abbot of a monastery.
flyingOx
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by flyingOx »

Mexicali wrote:If you think you're an awakened being whose aura is healing people, I think it's very possible you may want to seek psychiatric help. This is not meant as an insult; such claims in my experience have often preceded delusions of grandeur and breakdowns.
I have seen many psychiatrists in the past, and even then they could not really find anything wrong with me. I was just sad. Anyway, you make me laugh. Being crazy doesn't bother me either. Some might say going around in a robe is crazy, too. But as far as all of the healings that have been going on around here lately, and the fact that I am not concerned with self anymore, it is definitely not insanity or grandeur.
One is encouraged to seek the truth, but be warned if you ever find it, you will be treated as blasphemous.
flyingOx
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by flyingOx »

Ngawang Drolma wrote:Hi friend,

I mean this only to be helpful, not to make you feel uncomfortable. I'm going to share a personal story.

When I first started meditating, I found a "void" kind of quickly. It was blissful! An hour could pass and it only felt like a couple of minutes (at the most) to me. In that void nothing existed, including me. I believe I was getting what could be called "emptiness sickness." Emptiness sickness can mean other things as well. Eventually I preferred meditating to anything or anyone, and I preferred to be doing meditating over anything else. In fact I became sort of addicted. But I recovered from the emptiness sickness.

For me, connecting with a teacher proved to be a huge help. And I was able to continue to meditate (and learned some very good practices) but I was much more grounded. Now I'm not saying that what happened with me is happening to you. I'm just sharing a story.

The value of spiritual friends is tremendous for anyone! As the Buddha told Ananda, "they are the whole of spiritual life!" So having a spiritual friend or guide to evaluate our progress is invaluable. Even people with accomplishments have been known to have teachers, so maybe you would like having one too. Please let us know if we can help you find a person to connect with in your area.

Best wishes,
Drolma
I thought emptiness was the goal. Am I mistaken? Anyway, I would love to find a teacher, but I currently have no money. Do Theravadan teachers require payment? I could do like I do for my mother on her birthdays, write songs. LOL
One is encouraged to seek the truth, but be warned if you ever find it, you will be treated as blasphemous.
flyingOx
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by flyingOx »

TheDhamma wrote:Hi FlyingOx,

Interesting poem. I notice you used the word "eternal" about 7 times. Do you know that there is a little controversy over some of Thanissaro Bhikkhu's works? Some have found his teachings to be bordering on eternalism. That is why I asked your opinion of nibbana as I wanted to see you much you may have been led or misled (whichever the case may be) by his writings.

We live in the current dispensation of Gotama Buddha. Fortunately for us, there is no need to go at it alone. You can find a teacher as others have mentioned to help guide you. There is no need to go off into the wilderness on your own and meditate by yourself without any guidance. Certainly there are some monks who go off to a cave or lonely place for extended times, even years, but it is always after some good guidance from a teacher and / or abbot of a monastery.
I see.
One is encouraged to seek the truth, but be warned if you ever find it, you will be treated as blasphemous.
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Ngawang Drolma.
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by Ngawang Drolma. »

flyingOx wrote:
Ngawang Drolma wrote:Hi friend,

I mean this only to be helpful, not to make you feel uncomfortable. I'm going to share a personal story.

When I first started meditating, I found a "void" kind of quickly. It was blissful! An hour could pass and it only felt like a couple of minutes (at the most) to me. In that void nothing existed, including me. I believe I was getting what could be called "emptiness sickness." Emptiness sickness can mean other things as well. Eventually I preferred meditating to anything or anyone, and I preferred to be doing meditating over anything else. In fact I became sort of addicted. But I recovered from the emptiness sickness.

For me, connecting with a teacher proved to be a huge help. And I was able to continue to meditate (and learned some very good practices) but I was much more grounded. Now I'm not saying that what happened with me is happening to you. I'm just sharing a story.

The value of spiritual friends is tremendous for anyone! As the Buddha told Ananda, "they are the whole of spiritual life!" So having a spiritual friend or guide to evaluate our progress is invaluable. Even people with accomplishments have been known to have teachers, so maybe you would like having one too. Please let us know if we can help you find a person to connect with in your area.

Best wishes,
Drolma
I thought emptiness was the goal. Am I mistaken? Anyway, I would love to find a teacher, but I currently have no money. Do Theravadan teachers require payment? I could do like I do for my mother on her birthdays, write songs. LOL
Hi Flying Ox,

I wouldn't worry to much about the money just now. Dana is always welcome but the important thing is probably making a connection and getting some feedback and direction. Are you in the United States?

As far as the goal, it is to be free from suffering/dukkha and to end rounds of rebirth. Emptiness is part of that picture (insofar as realizing dependent origination and anatta) but it's not the whole picture. I didn't mean to mislead you with the quote from Milarepa that I originally posted :smile:

As for retreat, I might suggest doing things in a certain order. I feel like in this instance the steps are: 1. spiritual friend 2. study materials 3. a solid practice 4. retreat. I'm glad you found Dhamma Wheel, there are lots of good people here, and some ordained practitioners participate.

This is just my input, and I am not an expert. I hope this is helpful.

Best wishes,
Drolma
Last edited by Ngawang Drolma. on Thu May 07, 2009 9:45 pm, edited 2 times in total.
MMK23
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by MMK23 »

flyingOx wrote:I see.
flyingOx, from what I've learnt from the 21st century, you aren't enlightened. Here's why:

* you haven't written a bestselling book,
* you haven't sold a revolutionary new doctrine,
* you don't have a web page and a fawning cyber community,
* you haven't mastered the art of contrived ineffability,
* your avatar "flyingOx" is not very auspicious,
* you haven't been interviewed by ANY of the Buddhist magazines or tv shows.
* you haven't said, "a circle has no beginning" ONCE,
* you haven't incorporated all of the other religions into a single grand megabuddhism,
* you haven't made a single buck from the dhamma (or have you?),

I bet you don't even have a single statue of the Buddha!

Best wishes to you my friend, you seem like you would be a really charming person to meet :hug:
flyingOx
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by flyingOx »

MMK23 wrote:
flyingOx wrote:I see.
flyingOx, from what I've learnt from the 21st century, you aren't enlightened. Here's why:

* you haven't written a bestselling book,
* you haven't sold a revolutionary new doctrine,
* you don't have a web page and a fawning cyber community,
* you haven't mastered the art of contrived ineffability,
* your avatar "flyingOx" is not very auspicious,
* you haven't been interviewed by ANY of the Buddhist magazines or tv shows.
* you haven't said, "a circle has no beginning" ONCE,
* you haven't incorporated all of the other religions into a single grand megabuddhism,
* you haven't made a single buck from the dhamma (or have you?),

I bet you don't even have a single statue of the Buddha!

Best wishes to you my friend, you seem like you would be a really charming person to meet :hug:
Wow! You are a mind reader! Cool! You are right, I have no Buddha statue. :buddha1: There! I'm well on my way, now. LOL
One is encouraged to seek the truth, but be warned if you ever find it, you will be treated as blasphemous.
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pink_trike
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by pink_trike »

He has, however, said some things that give some of us cause for concern about his well-being . Many of us here hope he shares his experience with a qualified Dharma teacher. If the sensations persist, I agree with a previous poster that seeking professional mental health care advise would be a wise caution.
Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by DNS »

MMK23 wrote: flyingOx, from what I've learnt from the 21st century, you aren't enlightened. Here's why:

* you haven't written a bestselling book,
* you haven't sold a revolutionary new doctrine,
* you don't have a web page and a fawning cyber community,
* you haven't mastered the art of contrived ineffability,
* your avatar "flyingOx" is not very auspicious,
* you haven't been interviewed by ANY of the Buddhist magazines or tv shows.
* you haven't said, "a circle has no beginning" ONCE,
* you haven't incorporated all of the other religions into a single grand megabuddhism,
* you haven't made a single buck from the dhamma (or have you?),
Hi MMK23,

I know you are being sarcastic and humorous, but Ajahn Chah, Shabkar, and to a certain extent, S. N. Goenka could fit all of the above and they are pretty realized beings or at least way up there. And of course there are many more who also never wrote a Dhamma book, never made money off the Dhamma/Dharma, but were still highly realized people.
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Re: Yikes! People are noticing the change in me.

Post by flyingOx »

pink_trike wrote:He has, however, said some things that give some of us cause for concern about his well-being . Many of us here hope he shares his experience with a qualified Dharma teacher. If the sensations persist, I agree with a previous poster that seeking professional mental health care advise would be a wise caution.
LOL Like what? What have I said that causes concern?
One is encouraged to seek the truth, but be warned if you ever find it, you will be treated as blasphemous.
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