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ajahn chah - Page 2 - Dhamma Wheel

ajahn chah

On the cultivation of insight/wisdom
hermitwin
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby hermitwin » Sun May 20, 2012 9:33 pm

Once again, the term 'vipassana' comes up.
Beginners have a hard time separating the unique significance
of this word in the burmese tradition vs others eg thai tradition.
In the burmese tradition (mahasi sayadaw) tradition, 'vipassana' is THE method taught by Buddha to reach enlightenment.
In other traditions, "vipassana" means insight. It is not a type of meditation.
I think it would be extremely helpful if the followers of mahasi sayadaw, goenka will acknowledge this. Otherwise, many people will remain confused, as I was for a long time.
I am not trying to debate whether the mahasi sayadaw method is good or not. But hoping to clear up a very common confusion faced by many beginners.

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retrofuturist
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby retrofuturist » Sun May 20, 2012 11:32 pm

Greetings Hermitwin,

Thanks for sharing the experiences of your former confusion.

As I see it, the meditation itself might rightly be called satipatthana, whereas the possible result of that satipatthana practice is vipassana (clear seeing).

Would the use of such terminology have prevented confusion?

And for anyone who is still confused...

One Tool Among Many : The Place of Vipassana in Buddhist Practice
by Thanissaro Bhikkhu
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... etool.html

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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tiltbillings
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby tiltbillings » Mon May 21, 2012 1:11 am


hermitwin
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby hermitwin » Mon May 21, 2012 5:05 am

"As I see it, the meditation itself might rightly be called satipatthana, whereas the possible result of that satipatthana practice is vipassana (clear seeing)."

thanks retro, i am in full agreement.

hermitwin
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby hermitwin » Mon May 21, 2012 5:09 am

"Actually, not. The methodology that cultivates the factors leads to insight got called insight/vipassana well after the fact. The Burmese progenitors of this practice knew full well how vipassana is used in the suttas and commentaries. And that something I have heard explained by teachers more than once at vipassana retreats."

dear tilt, you are entitled to your opinion. you may even back your opinion with credible support. but the point is, there are other schools outside the mahasi traditin wil disagree with you. you may even find other schools outside the mahasi tradition which agree with you.
it is however important to present the bigger picture of the diversity of views concerning 'vipassana'. esp since we are talking about ajahn chah here.

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tiltbillings
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby tiltbillings » Mon May 21, 2012 5:16 am


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Cittasanto
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby Cittasanto » Mon May 21, 2012 6:35 am



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

Bakmoon
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby Bakmoon » Mon May 21, 2012 5:26 pm

The non-doing of any evil,
The performance of what's skillful,
The cleansing of one's own mind:
This is the Buddhas' teaching.

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mikenz66
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby mikenz66 » Mon May 21, 2012 7:33 pm


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reflection
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby reflection » Mon May 21, 2012 8:34 pm

I had that tought at a retreat once. It was simply called Tai Chi :tongue:

Anyway.. doesn't really have to do with the topic. :geek:

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Cittasanto
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby Cittasanto » Mon May 21, 2012 9:30 pm



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

danieLion
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby danieLion » Tue May 22, 2012 6:34 am


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tiltbillings
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby tiltbillings » Tue May 22, 2012 6:43 am


danieLion
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Re: ajahn chah

Postby danieLion » Tue May 22, 2012 7:16 am



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