Why one meal a day?

A place to discuss health and fitness, healthy diets. A fit body makes for a fit mind.
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hanzze_
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by hanzze_ »

jason c wrote:hey hanzze,

the heaven i am referring to is what i have come to understand as the christian heaven, very different from the buddhist heavenly realms. this misunderstanding is what i believe to be the cause of all the confusions amongst people of different religions(buddhists included). buddhist heavenly realms are within samsara there are 27 realms of existance that one could be reborn into, the fine material world(rupa-loka). there are four other realms, the immaterial world(arupa-loka). these four realms exist only as mind (this is the bardo of death, christian heaven)this is where an arahant or non-returner would go after death. the existance of this realm, but inability for all to experience it, is the cause of alot of the fighting between religions today.
but this is another topic.

metta ,
jason
Dear Jason,

maybe you like to check out the The Thirty-one Planes of Existence and yes, also the Christan ideas fits very well to this Planes of Existence (even there is some amount of creativity needed (Great Brahmas (Maha brahma) - One of this realm's most famous inhabitants is the Great Brahma, a deity whose delusion leads him to regard himself as the all-powerful, all-seeing creator of the universe).
Regarding the Arahant of a Buddha, he is not to be found (reborn) anywhere in this realms and that might be a little different to some believes of other school who teach about a nirvana-realm. Look at it, I guess it would clarify many things.
One more thing is, that one can reach Arahanthood even as a human and does not need to finish his last live in the highest realm.

This might be also useful:
from ariya-puggala - 'Noble Ones', 'noble persons'

(I) Through the path of Stream-winning (sotāpatti-magga) one 'becomes' free (whereas in realizing the fruition, one 'is' free) from the first 3 fetters (samyojana) which bind beings to existence in the sensuous sphere, to wit:
(1) personality-belief (sakkāya-ditthi; s. ditthi),
(2) skeptical doubt (vicikicchā),
(3) attachment to mere rules and rituals (sīlabbata-parāmāsa; s. upādāna).

(II) Through the path of Once-return (sakadāgāmi-magga) one becomes nearly free from the 4th and 5th fetters, to wit:
(4) sensuous craving (kāma-cchanda = kāma-rāga; s. rāga),
(5) ill-will (vyāpāda = dosa, s. mūla).

(III) Through the path of Non-return (anāgāmi-magga) one becomes fully free from the above-mentioned 5 lower fetters.

(IV) Through the path of Holiness (arahatta-magga) one further becomes free from the 5 higher fetters, to wit:
(6) craving for fine material existence (rūpa-rāga),
(7) craving for immaterial existence. (arūpa-rāga),
(8) conceit (māna),
(9) restlessness (uddhacca),
(10) ignorance (avijjā).

The stereotype Sutta text runs as follows:

(I) "After the disappearance of the three fetters, the monk has won the stream (to Nibbāna) and is no more subject to rebirth in lower worlds, is firmly established, destined for full enlightenment.
(II) "After the disappearance of the three fetters and reduction of greed, hatred and delusion, he will return only once more; and having once more returned to this world, he will put an end to suffering.
(III) "After the disappearance of the five fetters he appears in a higher world, and there he reaches Nibbāna without ever returning from that world (to the sensuous sphere).
(IV) "Through the extinction of all cankers (āsava-kkhaya) he reaches already in this very life the deliverance of mind, the deliverance through wisdom, which is free from cankers, and which he himself has understood and realized."

For the various classes of Stream-winners and Non-Returners, s. Sotāpanna, Anāgāmī.
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Cittasanto
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by Cittasanto »

jason c wrote:hi cittasanto,
thanks for the detailed reply, i found this info very helpful. i have not studied the rules of mendicents in any great detail, so thanks for your tolerance. my concerns have only been focused on my own practice.
Well for a lay person the rules of a mendicant are never going to be fully relevant in the same way as they are for mendicants. some rules can be adopted, but this would not be to the extent they are written in full for a mendicant.

i believe that as a layperson we can ex-spend much thought on issues concerning food, and the sooner we can come to peace with these issues, no thoughts on this matter will arise in our meditation, thus leading to better concentration, and deeper penetration of our meditation object.
There are other hindrances and forms they take besides hunger for food.

in conclusion, if a layperson decides to follow this rule to enhance his practice go for it, if one is comfortable with their food intake on a day to day basis, and is not distracted by food in meditation then this precept is not necessary to follow to attain stream entry. also a mendicent simply following these rules without questioning their nature could be impeeding their progress on the path.
well this is why I have brought up the Atthasila, these are renunciant rules for lay people, and can be observed on all uposatha days or on specific ones, these are relevant for lay people, and how Mendicants study is and hold the rules is none of your concern or effecting your practice in any way.

there are six sets of "precepts" which a lay person can adopt, the pancasila five precepts, the atthasila the eight precepts in two different forms, and the kammapatha the ranges of action (not strictly precepts) and the eightfold paths sila section. the two forms of the atthasila ony have one difference, the third precept, one is celibate the other is not.
these for a lay person are relevant and applicable, however if you are looking for the applicability of the mendicants rules to lay life they will never be 100% relevant for different reasons and a certain amount of interpretation is needed to make them applicable, sometimes this is due to the origin of the rule, as is the case here, sometimes this is due to the range of the rule which a lay person can not keep to due to how life is, or may even seam irrelevant because the context has been lost or its social context is no longer present, like the one mentioned by Hanzze.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
jason c
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by jason c »

hey cittisanto,
so as we progress on the path ridding ourselves of defilements by the accumulation of wisdom, one generally leans towards living a certain way.

hey hanzze,
i think we should start a new topic.
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Cittasanto
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by Cittasanto »

jason c wrote:hey cittisanto,
so as we progress on the path ridding ourselves of defilements by the accumulation of wisdom, one generally leans towards living a certain way.
Then Become a monk.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
jason c
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by jason c »

Cittasanto wrote:
jason c wrote:hey cittisanto,
so as we progress on the path ridding ourselves of defilements by the accumulation of wisdom, one generally leans towards living a certain way.
Then Become a monk.
the circumstances must be right before one becomes a monk. previous karma fills ones life with responsibilities. one cannot be so selfish as to abandon these.
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Cittasanto
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by Cittasanto »

jason c wrote:
Cittasanto wrote:
jason c wrote:hey cittisanto,
so as we progress on the path ridding ourselves of defilements by the accumulation of wisdom, one generally leans towards living a certain way.
Then Become a monk.
the circumstances must be right before one becomes a monk. previous karma fills ones life with responsibilities. one cannot be so selfish as to abandon these.
yet it is ones pressent Kamma that really matters, don't play flip flop directions.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
jason c
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by jason c »

hey cittasanto can you clarify your last statement?
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Cittasanto
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by Cittasanto »

jason c wrote:hey cittasanto can you clarify your last statement?
Yes, care about how you act now, be one thing, and true to it.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
jason c
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by jason c »

Cittasanto wrote:
jason c wrote:hey cittasanto can you clarify your last statement?
Yes, care about how you act now, be one thing, and true to it.
yes, be present NOW, pay attention to NOW, this is what the buddha taught and meditation is practice to cultivate this.
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hanzze_
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by hanzze_ »

That's just another runaway. Jason, be patient with you and take care of your responsibilities first but when ever your responsibilities are gone (or realized as excuse and not real responsibilities but just greed) be careful to take no more other. We love responsibilities to give us a reason for struggling on.

A maybe good story:
Practice for the Householder

You have often asked about the path of the householder. Household life is both hard and easy hard to do, easy to understand. It is as if you were to come complaining to me with a red-hot coal in your hand, and I were to tell you to simply drop it. "No, I won't," you say. "I want it to be cold." Either you must drop it, or you must learn to be very patient.

"How can I drop it?" you ask. Can you just drop your family? Drop it in your heart. Let go of your inner attachment. You are like a bird that has laid eggs; you have a responsibility to sit with and hatch them. Otherwise, they will become rotten.

You may want the members of your family to appreciate you, to understand why you act in certain ways, yet they may not. Their attitude may be intolerant, closed-minded. If the father is a thief and the son disapproves, is he a bad child? Explain things as well as you can, make an honest effort, then let go. If you have a pain and go to the doctor, but he and all his medicines cannot cure it, what can you do but let it go?

If you think in terms of my family, my practice, this kind of self-centered view is just another cause of suffering. Do not think of finding happiness, either living with others or living alone-just live with the Dharma. Buddhism helps to work out problems, but we must practice and develop wisdom first. You do not just throw rice into a potful of water and immediately have boiled rice. You have to build the fire, bring the water to a boil, and let the rice cook long enough. With wisdom, problems can eventually be solved by taking into account the karma of beings. Understanding family life, you can really learn about karma, about cause and effect, and can begin to take care of your action in the future.

Practicing in a group, in a monastery, or at a retreat is not so hard; you are too embarrassed to miss sittings with others. But when you go home, you find it difficult; you say that you are lazy or unable to find time. You give away your personal power, projecting it onto others, onto situations or teachers outside yourself. Just wake up! You create your own world. Do you want to practice or not?

Just as we monks must strive with our precepts and ascetic practices, developing the discipline that leads to freedom, so you lay people must do likewise. As you practice in your homes, you should endeavour to refine the basic precepts. Strive to put body and speech in order. Make real effort, practice continuously. As for concentrating the mind, do not give up because you have tried it once or twice and are not at peace. Why should it not take a long time? How long have you let your mind wander as it wished without
doing anything to control it? How long have you allowed it to lead you around by the nose? Is it any. wonder that a month or two is not enough to still it?

Of course, the mind is hard to train. When a horse is really stubborn, do not feed it for a while-it will come around. When it starts to follow the right.
course, feed it a little. The beauty of our way of life is that the mind can be trained. With our own right effort, we can come to wisdom.

To live the lay life and practice Dharma, one must be in the world but remain above it. Virtue, beginning with the five basic precepts, is all important, parent to all good things. It is the basis for removing wrong from the mind, removing the cause of distress and agitation. Make virtue really firm. Then practice your formal meditation when the opportunity presents itself. Sometimes the meditation will be good, sometimes not. Do not worry about it, just continue. If doubts arise, just realize that they, like everything else in the mind, are impermanent.

As you continue, concentration will arise. Use it to develop wisdom. See like and dislike arising from sense contact and do not attach to them. Do not be anxious for results or quick progress. An infant first crawls, then learns to walk, then to run. Just be firm in your virtue and keep practicing.
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Cittasanto
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by Cittasanto »

jason c wrote:
Cittasanto wrote:
jason c wrote:hey cittasanto can you clarify your last statement?
Yes, care about how you act now, be one thing, and true to it.
yes, be present NOW, pay attention to NOW, this is what the buddha taught and meditation is practice to cultivate this.
there is a little more to it than just that.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
jason c
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by jason c »

please share.
metta,
jason
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Cittasanto
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by Cittasanto »

jason c wrote:please share.
metta,
jason
it is right there in what I wrote in both counts, underlined in the quoted text in my last post!
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
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Hanzze
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Re: what is the relevence of eating before noon?

Post by Hanzze »

Dear Jason,

I guess the Instructions to Rahula is the most useful guide to come buy one self into the right line, without seeking to much reference in "this should be" and "that should be". Even in regard to food, its a all round advice without elbow where ever we are.

Using past, present and both for a better future without much speculations.
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_
GirlBoyGirl
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Re: Why one meal a day?

Post by GirlBoyGirl »

This is a really interesting thread. There is NO way I could get my husband on board with this but it is interesting to say the least. I don't know how my body would handle one meal a day. I usually eat the frequent small meals a day or I get weak/dizzy.

On an unrelated note, I love Goofaholix's Syd the Science Kid avatar! :)
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