HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

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Sutiro
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HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby Sutiro » Wed Sep 05, 2012 7:20 am

In a recent post there was a lot of interest in famous people who are Buddhists. Two of those are arguably the most famous but which one is number one? Both have compelling credentials but I would like to open a debate by putting the case for Aung San Suu Kyi based on these observations:

Both have waged a long campaign for the liberation of their respective countries in a peaceful, resolute and noble manner but Suu Kyi seems to have succeeded where the Dalai Lama has not and probably will not.

HHDL is particularly famous in Western countries but in Asian countries, particularly China he is not popular and is seen as a relic of a backward era.

Whereas ASSK is universally famous especially in countries like China, Vietnam, Laos, Malaysia,India and Burma of course where she is seen as an icon for democratic reform and a model of how to achieve it.

HHDL is not a prime advocate for democracy but for a return to a system that is out of step with modern reality.

I feel that if there were to be a world vote I think the lady would win hands down due to the weight of numbers from the Chinese vote alone.

That's my ten cents worth:)

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James the Giant
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Re: HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby James the Giant » Wed Sep 05, 2012 7:44 am

I didn't realise there was a popularity contest going on, cool.
I say put them both in a cage with their choice of weapons, and may the least compassionate win!

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Then,
saturated with joy,
you will put an end to suffering and stress.
SN 9.11

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Kim OHara
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Re: HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby Kim OHara » Wed Sep 05, 2012 7:55 am

I don't think that comparing the celebrity-value of two people who have given the world far more than mere celebrity is in any way useful but, in the hope of stopping us wasting time on it, I provide an answer to the OP:
Screen shot 2012-09-05 at 5.50.22 PM.png
Screen shot 2012-09-05 at 5.50.22 PM.png (22.03 KiB) Viewed 737 times
Screen shot 2012-09-05 at 5.50.41 PM.png
Screen shot 2012-09-05 at 5.50.41 PM.png (18.99 KiB) Viewed 737 times


:popcorn:
KIm

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Re: HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby Annapurna » Wed Sep 05, 2012 8:03 am

Sutiro wrote:In a recent post there was a lot of interest in famous people who are Buddhists. Two of those are arguably the most famous but which one is number one? Both have compelling credentials but I would like to open a debate by putting the case for Aung San Suu Kyi based on these observations:

Both have waged a long campaign for the liberation of their respective countries in a peaceful, resolute and noble manner but Suu Kyi seems to have succeeded where the Dalai Lama has not and probably will not.

HHDL is particularly famous in Western countries but in Asian countries, particularly China he is not popular and is seen as a relic of a backward era.

Whereas ASSK is universally famous especially in countries like China, Vietnam, Laos, Malaysia,India and Burma of course where she is seen as an icon for democratic reform and a model of how to achieve it.

HHDL is not a prime advocate for democracy but for a return to a system that is out of step with modern reality.

I feel that if there were to be a world vote I think the lady would win hands down due to the weight of numbers from the Chinese vote alone.

That's my ten cents worth:)


I also don't see why there must be a popularity competition amongst the friends of the two.

"The winner creates himself enmity"

Buddha.

Secondly, this is like trying to compare apples with oranges.

Man/Woman.

Monk/no nun

Dhamma teacher/ no Dhamma teacher.

I think the comparison is over, already with this.

What they have in common is being Buddhists, overwhelmed by enemies.

But it doesn't affect their kindness.

Win-win.

What would the Buddha have said about a popularity contest amongst his monks...? ;)
http://www.schmuckzauberei.blogspot.com/

Sutiro
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Re: HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby Sutiro » Wed Sep 05, 2012 8:12 am

‘I wish to have nothing to do with fame, Nagita, nor let fame come upon me! Those who cannot easily attain this happiness of renunciation, this happiness of seclusion, this happiness of peace and enlightenment as I have obtained, let them enjoy this other base and indolent happiness, derived from gains, homage and fame.’ (AN The 5s)

That's what he did say about fame.

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Re: HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby James the Giant » Wed Sep 05, 2012 8:15 am

Woohoo, Dalai Lama wins, 53 to 14. (million)
I call that not just a win, but a right drubbing.
Poor old Aung San, she must be gutted with the loss.
Better luck at the next popularity Olympics eh. Oh, which is guess is the Burmese election in 2015.
Then,
saturated with joy,
you will put an end to suffering and stress.
SN 9.11

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Re: HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby Ben » Wed Sep 05, 2012 8:44 am

Greetings Sutiro

With regards to 'fame' it relates to awareness of the subject and not other criteria such as popularity or success in politics. On that parameter (awareness) I would be inclined to say that His Holiness the Dalai Lama would be more "famous" than Daw Aung San Suu Kyi.
kind regards,

Ben
Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.

Taṃ nadīhi vijānātha:
sobbhesu padaresu ca,
saṇantā yanti kusobbhā,
tuṇhīyanti mahodadhī.

Sutta Nipata 3.725

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Re: HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby pilgrim » Wed Sep 05, 2012 8:46 am

Kim O'Hara wrote:I don't think that comparing the celebrity-value of two people who have given the world far more than mere celebrity is in any way useful but, in the hope of stopping us wasting time on it, I provide an answer to the OP:
Screen shot 2012-09-05 at 5.50.22 PM.png
Screen shot 2012-09-05 at 5.50.41 PM.png


:popcorn:
KIm

Not fair....HHDL had several years head start.
And...maybe the mod should move this to the Lounge so that the humourless among us will stop fault-finding. :stirthepot:

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Re: HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby Sutiro » Wed Sep 05, 2012 9:25 am

Thanks pilgrim. It's just something to talk about.

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Ben
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Re: HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby Ben » Wed Sep 05, 2012 10:00 am

pilgrim wrote:And...maybe the mod should move this to the Lounge so that the humourless among us will stop fault-finding. :stirthepot:


Its been moved. But in future please make the request direct to mod/admin staff rather than derail the topic into meta-discussion.
Out of respect for the OP, please ensure that amongst the fun you give the topic serious consideration.
thanks for your cooperation

Ben
Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.

Taṃ nadīhi vijānātha:
sobbhesu padaresu ca,
saṇantā yanti kusobbhā,
tuṇhīyanti mahodadhī.

Sutta Nipata 3.725

Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR
Buddhist Life Stories of Australia
e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com

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LonesomeYogurt
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Re: HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby LonesomeYogurt » Wed Sep 05, 2012 4:05 pm

In terms of pure name awareness, it would definitely be the Dalai Lama.

But in terms of high regard, I think Aung San Suu Kyi is more universally respected - unless, of course, you happen to be president of Burma.

I agree that a no-holds-barred compassion-off would be the best way to decide this.

Two Buddhists enter...and actually, two Buddhists leave.
Gain and loss, status and disgrace,
censure and praise, pleasure and pain:
these conditions among human beings are inconstant,
impermanent, subject to change.

Knowing this, the wise person, mindful,
ponders these changing conditions.
Desirable things don’t charm the mind,
undesirable ones bring no resistance.

His welcoming and rebelling are scattered,
gone to their end,
do not exist.
- Lokavipatti Sutta

Stuff I write about things.

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Re: HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby Maarten » Tue Sep 11, 2012 6:52 pm

The most famous Buddhist is neither of these two. It is the Buddha! Just think of all those Buddha statues! :)

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Re: HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby Hanzze » Wed Sep 12, 2012 2:35 am

Many will not be happy with this statement and one does not make "friends" in saying this, but mainstreamly as "heros" regarded people are form a Dhamma view and more a Vinaya view often even the opposite of what is a hero in the final meaning of the word.

Of cause they do good in presenting the heritage of the Buddha (Buddhadayajja) which is said to be twofold, Amisa and Dhamma. How ever, it can be easily that there is much vatta nissita Dhamma heritage (worldy attainings) given, which is actually a good factor and reason for poppularity. While vivatta nissita dhamma (practicing torward ending the rounds of rebrith) heritage can not easly be populare.

Maya and Satheyya (which are always nessesary if one leads a political live or a leading possition) is also something that easily arises with popularity and can lead even to illusions for whole nations, even the whole earth.

I am not sure if popularity is a wealth sign for florishing of Dhamma but of cause a possibility and fruitful flour for many who have the karmic posibilities to see Dhamma.

But that all shold not be a reason to feel no sympathy joy for their personal success as well for those who are well guided and helped by them.
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Re: HH Dalai or Aung San Suu Kyi - most famous Buddhist?

Postby Dan74 » Wed Sep 12, 2012 6:03 am

Kim O'Hara wrote:I don't think that comparing the celebrity-value of two people who have given the world far more than mere celebrity is in any way useful but, in the hope of stopping us wasting time on it, I provide an answer to the OP:
Screen shot 2012-09-05 at 5.50.22 PM.png
Screen shot 2012-09-05 at 5.50.41 PM.png


:popcorn:
KIm


This is simply because Dali Lama is easier to spell!
_/|\_


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