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Path to Buddhahood - Page 4 - Dhamma Wheel

Path to Buddhahood

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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ancientbuddhism
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby ancientbuddhism » Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:22 pm

, by George D. Bond

This was just added to the Early Buddhism Resources thread.

This paper may be helpful to the discussion. Bond outlines an accretion of textual development and treatment of the arahant ideal in the Pāḷi Nikāyas; viz. what started as an immediate liberation fairly accessible to the ordinary person in the present life (diṭṭhe va dhamme), morphed into later developments of the discourses, where, as the doctrinal tenets regarding the path and the noble person are padded-out, the means becomes increasingly difficult and attainment of liberation more rarified to meet in one lifetime.

This paper also discusses commentarial treatment of the arahant, and some amusing scholarly missteps in interpretation.
I say, beware of all enterprises that require new clothes, and not rather a new wearer of clothes.” – Henry David Thoreau, Walden, 1854

Secure your own mask before assisting others. – NORTHWEST AIRLINES (Pre-Flight Instruction)


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daverupa
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby daverupa » Fri Sep 14, 2012 6:02 pm

The difference here seems to be over whether the scholastic materials of the Theravada are taken to be primary sources or secondary sources. In response to the idea that arahants were around during the compilation of these materials, one wonders how we can assign these alleged arahants solely to the Theravada school, and therefore to none of the others. In any event, the four great references ask us to compare these materials to the dhammavinaya, tacitly supporting the primacy of that early stratum.

Even here however, one ought to note that, as Analayo's comparative analysis of the Majjhima Nikaya discusses, even the Nikayas/Agamas show signs of commentarial and scholastic editing. Their great commonality is quite encouraging, but one is able to discern social valuations in much of the material in this way (e.g. Pali materials stress the way to heaven and the three knowledges more than the Chinese materials, which often stress the four ariyan categories and only present the third knowledge - the destruction of the asavas. This is just one example among many.).

Taking a hard-line scholastic approach ignores these subtleties, to deficient effect, i.e. additions can be taken as original and necessary rather than as embellishments rooted in a felt need for the development of social capital in the religion after the Buddha's final nibbana (for example).

It's complex.

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tiltbillings
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Sep 14, 2012 7:57 pm


Nyana
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby Nyana » Fri Sep 14, 2012 8:15 pm


Nyana
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby Nyana » Fri Sep 14, 2012 8:23 pm


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tiltbillings
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Sep 14, 2012 8:53 pm


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daverupa
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby daverupa » Fri Sep 14, 2012 9:20 pm


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tiltbillings
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Sep 14, 2012 9:45 pm


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tiltbillings
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Sep 14, 2012 9:58 pm

The Paṭisambhidāmagga is supposedly "penned" by Sariputta, even though it represents material that is clearly later than the suttas, but why would we favor the Theravada Psm over an equivalent but different text that reflects the Sarvastivadins' point of view that was supposedly "penned" by Sariputra?

I am certainly not going to say to hell with the commentaries and the VM and the like. Unlike some sutta-wallahs, I see a great of value in these later texts, but that does not mean that one cannot look to the suttas themselves to see what they say about something, and it seems that the Buddha in the suttas had a fair amount to say about the question of bodhi, and interestingly he never, that I have found, tied bodhi to such things a omniscience and other specific powers supposedly unique to him. The view in the suttas of bodhi is really quite radical, which gets lost in the later Buddhists valorizatrion of the Buddha.

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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby Nyana » Fri Sep 14, 2012 10:14 pm


Nyana
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby Nyana » Fri Sep 14, 2012 10:23 pm


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tiltbillings
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Sep 14, 2012 10:56 pm


Nyana
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby Nyana » Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:24 pm


Nyana
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby Nyana » Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:31 pm


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daverupa
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby daverupa » Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:46 pm


Nyana
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby Nyana » Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:55 pm


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tiltbillings
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby tiltbillings » Sat Sep 15, 2012 12:30 am


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Modus.Ponens
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby Modus.Ponens » Sat Sep 15, 2012 1:25 am

I don't want to offend you with this question, Nana, it's just another angle from which to aproach the matter.

Are there two kinds of Nibbana?
He turns his mind away from those phenomena, and having done so, inclines his mind to the property of deathlessness: 'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.'
(Jhana Sutta - Thanissaro Bhikkhu translation)

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tiltbillings
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby tiltbillings » Sat Sep 15, 2012 1:29 am


Nyana
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Re: Path to Buddhahood

Postby Nyana » Sat Sep 15, 2012 2:32 am



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