Ideas for a strong oath

Theravāda in the 21st century - modern applications of ancient wisdom

Ideas for a strong oath

Postby purple planet » Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:40 pm

I am trying to take an oath that i will not hear music , not read newspapers ect ect .... and to do everything as much as possible to be as mindful as i can -

i did it once and it turned out good - but i stopped i really believe i need to take it to the extreme (without becoming a monk or going on a retreat) - and by extreme i mean no music or stuff for fun -

I want to do a ceremony so the oath will get stuck in my head - i dont want to take the percpects cause i still kill mosquitoes and i eat all day (i want to eat without the "fun" "greed" factor by eating only mindfuly and only healthy food)

- In short : what i would like to hear are intersting idea on how to take an oath - ways to make it memorable - i would take a "blood oath" - cut my hand to make it bleed a bit but i would defintly would like to heat some other good ideas :lol: like maybe to eat something ect any idea no matter how stupid is welcomed .....
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby James the Giant » Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:52 pm

purple planet wrote:...i dont want to take the percpects ...

Not trying to discourage you or anything, but it's curious that you don't want to take the most basic 5 core precepts, but instead jump ahead to a sub-section of the seventh, and include a newspaper precept that doesn't even exist except for monks. And even then only some few hardcore monks.

purple planet wrote: no music or stuff for fun

Why no stuff for fun? What's the meaning of that for you?
Then,
saturated with joy,
you will put an end to suffering and stress.
SN 9.11
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby purple planet » Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:14 pm

I have no problem to talk about this - i just want to keep the main focus on ideas for an oath -

so everything i write next is just answers to what you said no connection to original question:


I will tell you what i did for a few days -

Why no stuff for fun? What's the meaning of that for you?
just stuff that i do not mindfuly -

music also is included there and also playing chess in the internet - also i read the news papers online usually - watching youtube videos - eating cake and coffe

Not trying to discourage you or anything, but it's curious that you don't want to take the most basic 5 core precepts, but instead jump ahead to a sub-section of the seventh, and include a newspaper precept that doesn't even exist except for monks. And even then only some few hardcore monks.


about the news paper - i read it online all day so its my addiction so this is defintly a good thing to reduce - i tryed to keep it to morning time but its hard

i used to be vegan im now on a "break" but i plan to get back to it when i can - i kill mosquitos cause they bite me -


i have back and pelivc pain so i cat really improve much by sitting meditation - i do a lot of walking meditation - but the walking slowly also hurts i cant do that also to much , so my only option is to try "daily life meditation" to try to be mindful during activitys i do like washing the dishes ect ... and because the meditation is actually the training for daily life - its really hard for me to be mindful without meditation - so going to this extreme helps a lot at least for me
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby James the Giant » Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:37 pm

Ok, interesting... thanks

A good way to keep an oath is to make it in front of some people who know you, and you then tell everyone you know that you have done it, and tell them you're really serious this time, and you will give each of them twenty bucks if you break your oath. And give them all a bit of paper with the oath and the twenty dollar promise typed on it, and your signature.

You can give me the promise too, I'll send you my paypal details. :mrgreen:
Then,
saturated with joy,
you will put an end to suffering and stress.
SN 9.11
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby James the Giant » Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:40 pm

Oh, and sorry for going off topic again, but can you list the Five Precepts for me?
I understand the mosquito thing, but how about the other four precepts?
Then,
saturated with joy,
you will put an end to suffering and stress.
SN 9.11
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby purple planet » Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:03 pm

I understand the mosquito thing, but how about the other four precepts?
no problem as long as when new people read this thread they will remember the original question - so i will put a small reminder and continue the conversation :

- In short : what i would like to hear are intersting idea on how to take an oath - ways to make it memorable - i would take a "blood oath" - cut my hand to make it bleed a bit but i would defintly would like to heat some other good ideas :lol: like maybe to eat something ect any idea no matter how stupid is welcomed .....

there now its all good

I do keeep most percpects just not all of them - even as an atheist i keep some percpects - like i dont use drugs or drink
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby DAWN » Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:09 pm

There is a proverb that says: if your arm take that is not allowed to be taken - cut off your arm... eyes... etc

I think it the best solution.
Actualy i have alredy stop music, radio, cinema, art, and the next week i will leave my PC in my parents home, and do not watch TV. So i will try to observe how my ego will do without all that support it.

When i take a decision to stop music (it was one of my favorite ocupation and also a little bit hobbie), i just took all my CDs and put them far, the same with radio in my car etc etc. Just cut off. In my experiance is the best solution.

Simplicity is the skill to be learned (c) Ajahn Jayasaro

James the Giant wrote:Ok, interesting... thanks

A good way to keep an oath is to make it in front of some people who know you, and you then tell everyone you know that you have done it, and tell them you're really serious this time, and you will give each of them twenty bucks if you break your oath. And give them all a bit of paper with the oath and the twenty dollar promise typed on it, and your signature.

You can give me the promise too, I'll send you my paypal details. :mrgreen:


Actuly, before i thinking the same, but now i see that it can be counter productive.
Why?
Cause it can bring a lot of suffering, put on a collar, it's not the aim. The aim is to be free of it and not just "not doing it". After all, i think it depend on peoples, but it can begin a collar, brings suffering.

When you are in front of the cake, and you say "i will not eat it" to others, but still sit in front of - after some time you will suffer, and feel tentation, but you have a collar, so it's very risky... you still conditioned by it.
But when you put the cake in the trash, you dont say anythink, you dont feel tentation, no suffering, no collar.... and after, when the cake apears on the table, you even dont know what taste it, you dont metter cause you was lived without it, you no more conditioned by it, this chain is cut off.

Is the same with music etc.
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby purple planet » Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:33 pm

I didnt want to say what i did last time but i will say it - i hope it wont prevent people from coming up with ideas taht are similar - the more ideas the better

this time i wrote on a paper : i swear i will not ..... and sienged it and hang it on the wall
and wrote on pages i wont : play,watch movines, listen to music ect ...

also i had from before small reminders and i
draw fire image and wrote in big letters "practice like my head is on fire" i put a small buddha statue on the shelf

but i had most of this reminders from before i really started to be good is when i made the oath -

and it worked really good until i had some event that destroyed my mindfulness completley - and it was hard returning to it

now i have this messed up thing that i did - which was to put animal abuse pictures on my screensaver and as desktop background and it inspired me to improve - this was very affective - so much that i didnt use the computer at all for 3 days - but when i didnt look at the images it lost its effect - and i cant hang this pictures at the house lol

thats why im looking for a good oath cause putting small reminders wasnt so effective to me - they are good but only to a level

now i remembered another thing i did in university - i would it a choclate bar and say - ok no more fooling around after this chocolate i will go crazy and study like crazy
Last edited by purple planet on Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby DAWN » Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:37 pm

And also, when you take the way of simple life you have to live alone, or with others like you. Cause if you still attached to someone who is attached to somethink that you dont attached, you still attached to it, so there is a risk to return to atachement for this condition.

Actualy it's not for the one who have many friends or very social life. Cause even if the one is no more attached for some kind of things, and still have many contacts with others, they will know that "he is one ascetic", and so they will give an identity to the one, and so after, the one will identify him self with this identity, it will be some kind of style.... So ascetic-ego will be created and supported by the reflection of him self that society reflect on it.
And when the one begins to take delight in this reflection of one Ascetic, he is caught by Mara...

So it's dengerous to tell anythink that can give you an identity that you can take delight in it....
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby DAWN » Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:43 pm

I see...

Ajahn Chaa was a great teacher, and actualy when some past distruction arise in the mind, it's very effectively just to say : "It's impermanent"
I find this formule very simple and very effictive :roll:
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby purple planet » Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:55 pm

DAWN i read your post about you wanting to become a monk - what i think is you shouldnt - i dont want to get in to this cause it will make people really go :offtopic: just in short cause i dont want to inspire you to become a monk - i didnt want to write this before cause i cant think of something that brings more bad karma than convincing someone not to be a monk ill just say it cause i dont want you to become a monk because of my thread - you can be a good home monk if your family agrees
sometime maybe its good when you have temptations in fרront of you so you will "have something to work with" plus im still not a beeliver i didnt even have one insight - i follow buddhism cause until now it make sense - a lot of sense but my family would feel bad if i will go to a monestry so untill i would be sure about the practice i wont leave house -

but again the oath worked for me like crazy - and exactly in that week i went to events with really really good food but had no problem cause of the oath
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby DAWN » Thu Sep 27, 2012 5:45 pm

purple planet wrote:DAWN i read your post about you wanting to become a monk - what i think is you shouldnt - i dont want to get in to this cause it will make people really go :offtopic: just in short cause i dont want to inspire you to become a monk - i didnt want to write this before cause i cant think of something that brings more bad karma than convincing someone not to be a monk ill just say it cause i dont want you to become a monk because of my thread - you can be a good home monk if your family agrees

Thanks a lot for your preoccupation, it's gentil.
Actualy i dont take a decision yet, i have to acheve somethink, and after that i will think about the future.

purple planet wrote:sometime maybe its good when you have temptations in fרront of you so you will "have something to work with" plus im still not a beeliver i didnt even have one insight - i follow buddhism cause until now it make sense - a lot of sense but my family would feel bad if i will go to a monestry so untill i would be sure about the practice i wont leave house -

but again the oath worked for me like crazy - and exactly in that week i went to events with really really good food but had no problem cause of the oath


I'am not sure that is good; Why?
Cause you can take delight in this tentation, fighting with tentation can be pleasent. Is not the aim.
The aim is not-distracted mind.
So this fighting with a tentation, is a trap of Mara.

So i thinks it's better to putt a cake in the trash. :thinking:
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby purple planet » Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:03 pm

well you might be right im actually not really sure - im actually really not focused now (today - thats why im so active in the forum :lol: )

Actualy i dont take a decision yet, i have to acheve somethink, and after that i will think about the future.


can i ask what it is ?? is that something an insight ?

its funny looking at the thread i think i made it go off topic - if a moderator is reading : maybe after DAWN will answer my question maybe this thread could be deleted and i will re-ask the question but only the in short part

the truth is that i actually wanted a descusion a bit thats why i didnt put a short question - but im very nervous to hear about some good oaths and to take the oath allready thats why i went crazy with the :offtopic: things + i wanted to use one of this cool simleys on the side :redherring: :strawman: :rolleye:
Last edited by purple planet on Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby DAWN » Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:30 pm

purple planet wrote:can i ask what it is


I'am an russian emigrant in france, and now i'am very close to get french nationality, after that i'am free.

purple planet wrote:the truth is that i actually wanted a descusion a bit thats why i didnt put a short question - but im very nervous to hear about some good oaths and to take the oath allready thats why i went crazy with the :offtopic: things + i wanted to use one of this cool simleys on the side :redherring: :strawman: :rolleye:

I'dont realy understand this part :embarassed:
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby purple planet » Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:39 pm

I'dont realy understand this part :embarassed:


the truth is that i actually wanted a descusion a bit thats why i didnt put a short question


descusion=discussion /chat i misspelled that

it was an apology that i allways said :offtopic: and i said i used it cause i was nervous to hear good ideas on how to take an oath so i can take it as soon as possible

the last part is a joke -that i only said :offtopic: just cause i wanted to use a smiley

for moderators : could you please delete this thread
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby DAWN » Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:53 pm

purple planet wrote:
I'dont realy understand this part :embarassed:


the truth is that i actually wanted a descusion a bit thats why i didnt put a short question


descusion=discussion /chat i misspelled that

it was an apology that i allways said :offtopic: and i said i used it cause i was nervous to hear good ideas on how to take an oath so i can take it as soon as possible

the last part is a joke -that i only said :offtopic: just cause i wanted to use a smiley

for moderators : could you please delete this thread


Oh yes. I see :namaste:

No i dont think that is an off topic
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby Hanzze » Fri Sep 28, 2012 2:51 am

purple planet wrote:I am trying to take an oath that i will not hear music , not read newspapers ect ect .... and to do everything as much as possible to be as mindful as i can -

i did it once and it turned out good - but i stopped i really believe i need to take it to the extreme (without becoming a monk or going on a retreat) - and by extreme i mean no music or stuff for fun -

I want to do a ceremony so the oath will get stuck in my head - i dont want to take the percpects cause i still kill mosquitoes and i eat all day (i want to eat without the "fun" "greed" factor by eating only mindfuly and only healthy food)

- In short : what i would like to hear are intersting idea on how to take an oath - ways to make it memorable - i would take a "blood oath" - cut my hand to make it bleed a bit but i would defintly would like to heat some other good ideas :lol: like maybe to eat something ect any idea no matter how stupid is welcomed .....

Great undertaking, purple planet, to go into direction of attha-sila and especial not hear music , not read newspapers ect ect is very useful to make some success in bhavana practice.

I guess to simply keep it in mind is the best way. But (just an idea) a bodily sighn would be maybe helpful. It's maybe for some to radical to shave the hair even it is very usual in traditional countries for people strating to observe eight precepts.
Cut of a little or change the hair would be maybe a ritual which reminds if it is even done all two weeks for example. Changing the way of dressing one self is another traditional support for the undertaking. Some wear a cloth bound over the left sholder for example or even change to white clothes. So you also have the "preassure" that you act like you look.

Great to hear about your undertaking and that you start to follow the ways of the wise and Arahants.

Much mudita
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby plwk » Fri Sep 28, 2012 3:29 am

Sigh... there was once a wise man who said let your yes be yes and your no be no...
And a cool Canadian woman who sang Why you have to go and make things so complicated?

Any wonder the Blessed One in the Dhammapada admonishes us...
Those who mistake the unessential to be essential and the essential to be unessential, dwelling in wrong thoughts, never arrive at the essential.
Those who know the essential to be essential and the unessential to be unessential, dwelling in right thoughts, do arrive at the essential.
Bhikkhus, if you develop and make much this one thing,
it invariably leads to weariness, cessation, appeasement, realization and extinction.
What is it? It is recollecting the Enlightened One.
If this single thing is recollected and made much,
it invariably leads to weariness, cessation, appeasement, realization and extinction.

Anguttara-Nikaya: Ekanipata: Ekadhammapali: Pañhamavagga
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby DAWN » Fri Sep 28, 2012 4:57 am

plwk wrote:Sigh... there was once a wise man who said let your yes be yes and your no be no...
And a cool Canadian woman who sang Why you have to go and make things so complicated?

Any wonder the Blessed One in the Dhammapada admonishes us...
Those who mistake the unessential to be essential and the essential to be unessential, dwelling in wrong thoughts, never arrive at the essential.
Those who know the essential to be essential and the unessential to be unessential, dwelling in right thoughts, do arrive at the essential.


What is essential ?
What is unessential ?
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Re: Ideas for a strong oath

Postby Hanzze » Fri Sep 28, 2012 5:02 am

Nibbana and a "pleasant life"
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_
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