Is the Buddha sexist

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
Mal
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Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2012 12:21 pm

Re: Is the Buddhs sexist

Post by Mal »

dreamov wrote:... women can not become self-enlightened (Buddha), teach self-discovered dhamma and establish a sangha.
Is there a quote in the suttas that supports this position?
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Bhikkhu Pesala
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Re: Is the Buddhs sexist

Post by Bhikkhu Pesala »

Mal wrote:
dreamov wrote:... women can not become self-enlightened (Buddha), teach self-discovered dhamma and establish a sangha.
Is there a quote in the suttas that supports this position?
Yes. The relevant passage is in the Aṅguttaranikaya, Aṭṭhānapāḷi, Dutiyavaggo
279. “Aṭṭhānametaṃ, bhikkhave, anavakāso yaṃ itthī arahaṃ assa sammāsambuddho. Netaṃ ṭhānaṃ vijjati. Ṭhānañca kho, etaṃ, bhikkhave, vijjati yaṃ puriso arahaṃ assa sammāsambuddho. Ṭhānametaṃ vijjatī”ti.

It is impossible, monks, that a woman can become a Fully Enlightened Buddha, It is possible, monks, that a man can become a Fully Enlightened Buddha.
It is entirely possible that a man can become a woman in the next existence, and that a woman can become a man in the next existence. This life is just a temporary condition. There are also some who are of indeterminate sex, and cases of sex change in this very life are not unheard of, so what about the next existence? Its your kamma — in which direction does your mind incline?

In a recent interview, Pink said that she believed in reincarnation, and wanted to be reborn as a dog, a pet of someone like herself — be careful what you wish for.
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Cassandra
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Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2012 2:48 am

Re: Is the Buddhs sexist

Post by Cassandra »

Mal wrote:
dreamov wrote:... women can not become self-enlightened (Buddha), teach self-discovered dhamma and establish a sangha.
Is there a quote in the suttas that supports this position?
There is one sutta but I don't think the sutta phase is Buddha-spoken. It is irrational to think all words in the suttas are completely fool-proof and have not faced any deterioration whatsoever during the course of transmission over many centuries.

I don't think a Buddha, with all his wisdom and compassion, would speak any words which could be discriminating to a certain group of the population merely based on their biological differences. It is unlikely an enlightened being, a wise one would just speak if the words do not serve any worthy cause or purpose.
steve19800
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Re: Is the Buddha sexist

Post by steve19800 »

In my opinion there is a difference between the effort and the nature.
We all want equality in every aspect of life, job, justice, etc. the same thing with gender equality, but that will never happen because the nature of things are different. They are different because they are different, not necessarily has to be gender differences.

Due to the nature of different organs between men and women, the body functions in the different way. Women have menstrual cycle, have to give birth, etc. and these make women become more emotional being compare to men. While in Buddhism jealousy, etc are part of defilements and sometimes delusion as well. So from this point of view, these can become hindrances for those who are seeking of enlightenment.
Cassandra
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Re: Is the Buddha sexist

Post by Cassandra »

steve19800 wrote:In my opinion there is a difference between the effort and the nature.
We all want equality in every aspect of life, job, justice, etc. the same thing with gender equality, but that will never happen because the nature of things are different. They are different because they are different, not necessarily has to be gender differences.

That's ok. But when a person is deprived of his or her rights to engage in some activity purely bases on his/her gender, then it becomes gender discrimination. For example, it is nature that a man doesn't have menstruation. But if a man is deprived of his rights to paint his nails and wear high heels if he so wishes, that is discrimination.
steve19800 wrote:So from this point of view, these can become hindrances for those who are seeking of enlightenment.
I think the pali canon has more than enough evidence that biological differences between men and women have nothing much to do with mental development.
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LonesomeYogurt
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Re: Is the Buddha sexist

Post by LonesomeYogurt »

steve19800 wrote:Due to the nature of different organs between men and women, the body functions in the different way. Women have menstrual cycle, have to give birth, etc. and these make women become more emotional being compare to men. While in Buddhism jealousy, etc are part of defilements and sometimes delusion as well. So from this point of view, these can become hindrances for those who are seeking of enlightenment.
This is incorrect.
Soma Sutta wrote: Setting at Savatthi. Then, in the morning, the bhikkhuni Soma dressed and, taking bowl and robe, entered Savatthi for alms. When she had walked for alms in Savatthi and had returned from her alms round, after her meal she went to the Blind Men's Grove for the day's abiding. Having plunged into the Blind Men's Grove, she sat down at the foot of a tree for the day's abiding.

Then Mara the Evil One, desiring to arouse fear, trepidation, and terror in the bhikkhuni Soma, desiring to make her fall away from concentration, approached her and addressed her in verse:
That state so hard to achieve Which is to be attained by the seers, Can't be attained by a woman With her two-fingered wisdom.

Then it occurred to the bhikkhuni Soma: "Now who is this that recited the verse — a human being or a non-human being?" Then it occurred to her: "This is Mara the Evil One, who has recited the verse desiring to arouse fear, trepidation, and terror in me, desiring to make me fall away from concentration."

Then the bhikkhuni Soma, having understood, "This is Mara the Evil One," replied to him in verses:

What does womanhood matter at all When the mind is concentrated well,
When knowledge flows on steadily
As one sees correctly into Dhamma.
One to whom it might occur,
'I'm a woman' or 'I'm a man'
Or 'I'm anything at all' —
Is fit for Mara to address.

Then Mara the Evil One, realizing, "The bhikkhuni Soma knows me," sad and disappointed, disappeared right there.
Clearly, womanhood has no bearing on the ability to practice Dhamma. Whether or not a woman can become self-enlightened, and whether or not that is due to any innate function of the universe or simply because the Buddha knew that no women would be allowed to spiritually progress in an age without wisdom, is irrelevant because we have a Buddha right now, and his teachings are equally open to men and women. To argue differently is to slander the Dhamma.
Gain and loss, status and disgrace,
censure and praise, pleasure and pain:
these conditions among human beings are inconstant,
impermanent, subject to change.

Knowing this, the wise person, mindful,
ponders these changing conditions.
Desirable things don’t charm the mind,
undesirable ones bring no resistance.

His welcoming and rebelling are scattered,
gone to their end,
do not exist.
- Lokavipatti Sutta

Stuff I write about things.
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