Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

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jackson
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Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

Postby jackson » Wed Nov 07, 2012 12:51 am

Hi everyone,
This question is just out of curiosity, but why are the dhamma and faith follower so rarely discussed? I've been studying Buddhism for around 10 years and it was only a few years ago that I even heard mention of these attainments. If it's true that once one becomes one of these that they are guaranteed stream-entry then shouldn't they be mentioned more often? Also is there any reason to doubt the validity of the suttas where these are mentioned?
Thank you for your time,
Jackson
"The heart of the path is quite easy. There’s no need to explain anything at length. Let go of love and hate and let things be. That’s all that I do in my own practice." - Ajahn Chah

santa100
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Re: Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

Postby santa100 » Wed Nov 07, 2012 2:48 am

They're mentioned pretty frequently in many suttas. You mean they rarely get mentioned here at the forum?

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/search_r ... ght.org%2F

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/search_r ... &sa=Search

jackson
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Re: Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

Postby jackson » Wed Nov 07, 2012 3:40 am

Hi santa100,
Perhaps I just haven't stumbled across the terms very often while reading the suttas, but I've listened to hundreds of Dhamma talks by the western Ajahns and barely heard mention of them, and they don't seem to be discussed on this forum very much as well. It could be a misperception on my part but it just seems they don't seem to get the attention they deserve.
Thanks for your reply,
Jackson
"The heart of the path is quite easy. There’s no need to explain anything at length. Let go of love and hate and let things be. That’s all that I do in my own practice." - Ajahn Chah

santa100
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Re: Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

Postby santa100 » Wed Nov 07, 2012 4:25 am

The Buddha showed different ways to slice and dice stuff. The Dhamma/Faith followers are parts of the Sevenfold classification of noble individuals ( http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html ) which is categorized based on their dominant faculty. And there's that more familiar Eightfold scheme that is categorized based on the paths and fruits (4 paths + 4 fruits)..

jackson
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Re: Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

Postby jackson » Wed Nov 07, 2012 5:12 am

Thanks for your reply santa,
Is it right to say that Dhamma and faith followers are Sotapanna then, just without the fruit? If so then that would explain why I rarely hear mention of them.
Much appreciated,
Jackson
"The heart of the path is quite easy. There’s no need to explain anything at length. Let go of love and hate and let things be. That’s all that I do in my own practice." - Ajahn Chah

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mikenz66
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Re: Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

Postby mikenz66 » Wed Nov 07, 2012 5:20 am


santa100
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Re: Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

Postby santa100 » Wed Nov 07, 2012 5:48 am

Hi Jackson, as Mike pointed out above, Dhamma/Faith followers is the equivalence of that 8th category of noble disciples of the Eightfold scheme: one on the Path toward Stream Entry.. :group:

jackson
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Re: Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

Postby jackson » Wed Nov 07, 2012 6:28 am

So out of curiosity, does this mean there are putthujanas that can also be considered noble ones? Also if I understand the Phassa Sutta which Mike posted does that mean stream entry is seeing that the eye, eye consciousness, and the object of the eye, the ear, ear consciousness, and the object of the ear, etc. only arise dependent on one another?
Thanks,
Jackson
"The heart of the path is quite easy. There’s no need to explain anything at length. Let go of love and hate and let things be. That’s all that I do in my own practice." - Ajahn Chah

santa100
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Re: Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

Postby santa100 » Wed Nov 07, 2012 2:33 pm


SarathW
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Re: Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

Postby SarathW » Wed Nov 07, 2012 11:49 pm

Hi Jackson
I did some research in the net in regard to this subject and found that this has been discussed in this forum for few occasion. The following link “What is Puthujjan0” is one of them which is very helpful.

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=513#p5704
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

jackson
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Re: Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

Postby jackson » Thu Nov 08, 2012 1:27 am

Thank you kindly for your replies, they are very helpful and much appreciated. The knowledge of the people on this board, and especially the Dhamma itself, is truly humbling. :anjali:
"The heart of the path is quite easy. There’s no need to explain anything at length. Let go of love and hate and let things be. That’s all that I do in my own practice." - Ajahn Chah

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mikenz66
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Location: New Zealand

Re: Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

Postby mikenz66 » Thu Nov 08, 2012 9:12 am

Actually, it's not so hard. All you need is a good reference. I would estimate that 90% of questions could be answered by simply flipping through Bhikkhu Bodhi's excellent Sutta collection and finding a suitable Sutta or explanation.... :reading:

:coffee:
Mike

jackson
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Re: Why are Dhamma and Faith follower rarely mentioned?

Postby jackson » Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:06 am

Thanks Mike, I'll have to get that book sometime. :anjali:
"The heart of the path is quite easy. There’s no need to explain anything at length. Let go of love and hate and let things be. That’s all that I do in my own practice." - Ajahn Chah


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