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Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha - Dhamma Wheel

Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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Ben
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Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby Ben » Thu Jun 25, 2009 12:15 pm

“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

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clw_uk
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby clw_uk » Thu Jun 25, 2009 12:20 pm

I think these things are unavoidable now in our present age with free speech and free expression etc. In relation to these things I think we should just keep in mind the Buddhas adivce not to get angry or sad when people make fun or criticise him or the Dhamma the same way we shouldnt be delighted when people praise him or the Dhamma


Metta
Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken

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Prasadachitta
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby Prasadachitta » Thu Jun 25, 2009 1:44 pm

Hi Ben,

I think it is a positive sign that there are those who feel its no problem to create disrespectful images of the Buddha. Do you think that it is unlikely we will find a Mohammad with an erection because of the wide spread reverence people have for him or because they fear the scorn and possible retribution that will result. I think people at some level know that Buddhist strive to cultivate a peaceful and tolerant attitude and so they are not as concerned about offending us.


Metta

Gabriel
"Beautifully taught is the Lord's Dhamma, immediately apparent, timeless, of the nature of a personal invitation, progressive, to be attained by the wise, each for himself." Anguttara Nikaya V.332

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Guy
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby Guy » Thu Jun 25, 2009 2:50 pm

If anyone wants to disparage the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha that is their problem. They have to deal with the consequences of expressing their disrespect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha. If we, identifying ourselves as Buddhists, get offended and angry at their remarks then that is our problem.

Why get upset? Why make problems?

With Metta,

Guy
Four types of letting go:

1) Giving; expecting nothing back in return
2) Throwing things away
3) Contentment; wanting to be here, not wanting to be anywhere else
4) "Teflon Mind"; having a mind which doesn't accumulate things

- Ajahn Brahm

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Jechbi
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby Jechbi » Thu Jun 25, 2009 3:39 pm


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genkaku
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby genkaku » Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:31 pm

Hi Ben -- I think your practice is important.
I think your opinions, like mine, are less important.

Whether people run around turning a shard of bone into an object of veneration or a pair of underpants an object of dismay; whether they call their views the one true way or disparage the views of others as heretical or apostate ... when has it ever been different? Veneration is bound to generate disagreement.

Best to leave veneration and disagreement to others and just keep up your own good practice. As Gautama allegedly said, "It is not what others do and do not do that is my concern. It is what I do and do not do -- that is my concern."

Yeah, we all get cranky from time to time. Nothing saying we can't or won't ... sometimes it's downright fun...or anyway I think so. But also ... just keep up the good practice.
Smile just one smile




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David N. Snyder
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby David N. Snyder » Thu Jun 25, 2009 6:45 pm

Bhikkhu Bodhi talks about tolerance and specifically about the cartoon depictions of Muhammad in this video:



In the video (not that long) he makes the point that people should be tolerant and accepting of the adherent's of other religions wishes. Muslims do not like any images of Muhammad, period. Those wishes should be accepted by others. But he also makes the point that some adherents can be too sensitive and can sometimes over-react and certainly violence is not an appropriate response to a cartoon.

I personally don't mind the depictions of Buddha images in restaurants and clubs or in advertising, but the bulge between the legs would be going too far.
Image




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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby Individual » Thu Jun 25, 2009 8:30 pm

The best things in life aren't things.


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Thaibebop
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby Thaibebop » Thu Jun 25, 2009 10:18 pm


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BlackBird
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby BlackBird » Fri Jun 26, 2009 12:17 am

I too, used to get upset by these things. But a world without disrespect is a world where everyone's a Noble One.
As long as one percieves the problem to be external, then one will suffer as a result. You can't change these things - But you can change yourself.

Stay well friends
Jack.
"For a disciple who has conviction in the Teacher's message & lives to penetrate it, what accords with the Dhamma is this:
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." -

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AdvaitaJ
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby AdvaitaJ » Fri Jun 26, 2009 1:42 am

The issue for me isn't being upset by the disrespect so much as irritation with their ignorance. If these people knew how immediately helpful and significant the Buddha's teachings were, they'd probably never do such things. :cookoo:

Regards: AdvaitaJ
The birds have vanished down the sky. Now the last cloud drains away.
We sit together, the mountain and me, until only the mountain remains.
Li Bai

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tiltbillings
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jun 26, 2009 1:49 am

The offending "statue":

http://news.3yen.com/2009-06-25/buddhas ... ls-busted/

Even without a bulge, it is rather nasty.

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Thaibebop
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby Thaibebop » Fri Jun 26, 2009 4:17 am


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Ben
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby Ben » Fri Jun 26, 2009 6:56 am

Hi all

I want to thank you all for your kind responses. And I agree with the majority of sentiments expressed. As I said on another thread, I think that it is our collective equanimity in the face of such ignorance, which is our strength. I also agree with Genkaku, our practice is most important.

I hope you don't mind if I explore another aspect to this discussion. While I was reading your responses, the thought occured to me that if we don't show respect for the triple gem, do we become complicit in the excesses of others, be it stupid remarks by way of a charactature, or some of the other examples I mentioned above? While I agree that we honor the Buddha by walking on the path, it has to be acknowledged that most of us live in highly secularised western societies where appearances are all important. If we do not defend the Buddhadhamma, do we become complicit in someone dispariaging the Buddhadhamma, thus creating a barrier for them in encountering the Dhamma?

Thanks for your kind consideration - I look forward to reading your responses.
Metta

Ben
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

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Jechbi
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby Jechbi » Fri Jun 26, 2009 7:02 am


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Ben
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby Ben » Fri Jun 26, 2009 7:28 am

Hi jechbi

If you've got the time and inclination, I would appreciate it if you could expand on your comment.
Kind regards

Ben
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

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Jechbi
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby Jechbi » Fri Jun 26, 2009 8:18 am

Thanks for asking, Ben.

I don't expect everyone to agree, but I think we participate in any situation in which we find ourselves, and so we bear some responsibility if, through inaction, we allow something to occur even though we see how we might be able to make a difference and create a better situation.

What we choose to do and how we choose to act will always depend on the circumstances. But stupid remarks or caricatures almost by their nature are likely to convey an incorrect and counterproductive message that is unhelpful to those who hear it in ignorance. So why not address the ignorance in a caring way? No need to be overbearing, but maybe through humor or a friendly remark, it would be possible to awaken a sense of closer examination of what's going on.

On the other hand if we stand idly by while someone actually disparages the Buddhadhamma, then by default we're sending the message that there's nothing wrong with what's being said or done. Defending the Buddhadhamma doesn't mean being a jerk or declaring jihad or anything like that. But I do think that inaction does not equate to no kamma if we hear or see something occuring that would tend to fuel greed, hate or delusion, and we decide to try to stay out of it. Because we're already in it. That is our kamma.

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Guy
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby Guy » Fri Jun 26, 2009 11:04 am

I think there are other dimensions to consider before writing off inaction as unskilful, at least in some situations. Maybe there are some more extreme situations where I would agree that responsive action is necessary.

1) Generally speaking, not that I hold this as absolutey true, I believe that it's reasonable to assume that people who are coming from a position of intentionally making fun of the Buddha/Dhamma/Sangha (whether or not they are aware of the ramifications of doing so) will not care about us speaking out against their disrespectful behaviour. If they are ignorant and arrogant enough to make fun of something they don't fully understand to begin with, what makes us think that we have the means to change such a persons mind? In my experience, such ignorant/arrogant people are impossible to talk any sense into and are not worth the time.

2) If the Buddha was fully enlightened, if he taught the good and true teaching, if there are disciples to this day who practice as the Buddha taught and have attained various stages of enlightenment then how do the actions of some ignorant people take anything away from the Buddha/Dhamma/Sangha? Surely the only people who have anything to lose are the disrespectful people themselves. These people are robbing themselves. If we have faith in Buddha/Dhamma/Sangha then it is impossible for them to rob us.

3) Our resources could be put to better uses than trying to make everyone respectful and politically correct because it makes us uncomfortable. It would be much more skilful, imo, to focus on the subject of the discomfort we feel (ie. how the discomfort manifests itself in our own body and mind) than focusing on the object of our discomfort (ie. the people that we find offensive). If we go around trying to solve every injustice in the world and trying to make the external world perfect then we will have no resources left to focus on the inner world. As I understand the Buddha's teachings, it is because there are always going to be such problems as injustice, disrespect, people saying and doing things offensive that we need to sort these issues out in our own mind's rather than trying to change everyone else's mind.

With Metta,

Guy
Four types of letting go:

1) Giving; expecting nothing back in return
2) Throwing things away
3) Contentment; wanting to be here, not wanting to be anywhere else
4) "Teflon Mind"; having a mind which doesn't accumulate things

- Ajahn Brahm

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Dhammabodhi
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby Dhammabodhi » Fri Jun 26, 2009 12:46 pm

Hi everyone,

Yesterday I came across this news story:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Indi ... 703382.cms

I think what the girl did and what the newspaper is doing is commendable.
However, I do believe that up to a certain level we have to accept such ignorance and move on. Come to think of it, even more sinister forms of ignorance were present(and still are) both in the temporal and spacial vicinity of the Buddha himself! But he only preached to those who were willing to listen, and even then some people were not convinced! Ignorance is the greatest tragedy of mankind.

Metta,
Dhammabodhi
"Take rest, take rest."-S.N.Goenka

thornbush
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Re: Respect for the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha

Postby thornbush » Fri Jun 26, 2009 2:03 pm



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