Cittapassana?

Discussion of Satipatthana bhavanā and Vipassana bhavana.

Cittapassana?

Postby m0rl0ck » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:31 pm

Having started with zazen and then being given a chan huatou, i think my current practice could probably best be described as cittapassana. The object of my concentration is what i found doing the huatou.
What i experience is space and awareness and i focus right back at the awareness. I sit with it, but would like some ideas on how to proceed. Do i just sit with it? Do i concentratedly investigate? How much push (not a great term, but im hoping some of you will know what i mean) do i give it?
Sometimes i feel like im just sort of hanging out and im not sure thats the best thing to do at this point.
Last edited by m0rl0ck on Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Even if you've read the whole Canon and can remember lots of teachings; even if you can explain them in poignant ways, with lots of people to respect you; even if you build a lot of monastery buildings, or can explain inconstancy, stress, and not-self in the most detailed fashion ... The only thing that serves your own true purpose is release from suffering.

"And you'll be able to gain release from suffering only when you know the one mind."

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/thai ... eleft.html
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Re: Cittapassana

Postby daverupa » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:37 pm

In short, gladden it, then compose it, then release it. 'Sensitive to it' is happening well enough, it would seem.
    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.
- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]
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Re: Cittapassana?

Postby Goofaholix » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:52 pm

Sayadaw U Teganiya is one of the most well known teachers of Cittanupassana see http://sayadawutejaniya.org/ there are a lot of books to download and links to MP3's
"Whenever we feel that we are definitely right, so much so that we refuse to open up to anything or anybody else, right there we are wrong. It becomes wrong view. When suffering arises, where does it arise from? The cause is wrong view, the fruit of that being suffering. If it was right view it wouldn't cause suffering." - Ajahn Chah
"Remember you dont meditate to get anything, but to get rid of things. We do it, not with desire, but with letting go. If you want anything, you wont find it." - Ajahn Chah
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Re: Cittapassana?

Postby mikenz66 » Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:37 am

Hi m0rl0ck,

If you're talking about contemplation of citta, as in the Satipatthana sutta then a common interpretation of that section of sutta is that it's about "mood" or "general emotion", and sometimes is translated "mind state", or "state of mind":
"And how does a monk remain focused on the mind in & of itself? There is the case where a monk, when the mind has passion, discerns that the mind has passion. ... without passion ... aversion ... without aversion ... delusion ... without delusion ... constricted ... scattered ... enlarged ... surpassed ... unsurpassed ... concentrated ... not concentrated ... released ... not released ...

One of the difficulties with this aspect of satipatthana is that the "mind state" tends to be relatively stable. Just as the climate can be relatively stable, even though the weather changes from day to day, the mind state tends (at least for most people) to be relatively stable (scattered for a while, unscattered for a while, etc...). With a little work I can see body sensations, feelings, thoughts, etc. come and go with great rapidity, so their impermanent and not-self characteristics are somewhat obvious. However, as concentration builds the mind state can actually seem more stable (unscattered!), and it may well be the last thing that one takes as a "true self". ("This is mine, this is my self: this perfect, calm, super-meditator mind...").

:anjali:
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Re: Cittapassana?

Postby pegembara » Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:59 am

m0rl0ck wrote:Having started with zazen and then being given a chan huatou, i think my current practice could probably best be described as cittapassana. The object of my concentration is what i found doing the huatou.
What i experience is space and awareness and i focus right back at the awareness. I sit with it, but would like some ideas on how to proceed. Do i just sit with it? Do i concentratedly investigate? How much push (not a great term, but im hoping some of you will know what i mean) do i give it?
Sometimes i feel like im just sort of hanging out and im not sure thats the best thing to do at this point.



When you are focussing back at awareness(awareness looking back at itself), ask what is it that is aware of the awareness? Can there also be an awareness of the awareness of awareness etc? Which of these "awareness" is the self?

I find that there can be an awareness being aware of awareness... etc. to infinite regress like 2 parallel mirrors reflecting, none of the awareness can be called a self.
And what is right speech? Abstaining from lying, from divisive speech, from abusive speech, & from idle chatter: This is called right speech.
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Re: Cittapassana?

Postby Cittasanto » Mon Nov 05, 2012 8:40 am

here are a couple of threads
viewtopic.php?f=41&t=2856&hilit=cittanupassana#p40939

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=6099&p=95875&hilit=cittanupassana#p95864

Although there is a PDF shared in one of the Threads I couldn't see it in my quick search
http://www.abuddhistlibrary.com/Buddhis ... ssana2.pdf
This offering maybe right, or wrong, but it is one, the other, both, or neither!
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Blog, - Some Suttas Translated, Ajahn Chah.
"Others will misconstrue reality due to their personal perspectives, doggedly holding onto and not easily discarding them; We shall not misconstrue reality due to our own personal perspectives, nor doggedly holding onto them, but will discard them easily. This effacement shall be done."
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Re: Cittapassana?

Postby Cittasanto » Mon Nov 05, 2012 8:50 am

Here is the Buddhas advise on the subject.
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html
and not to forget the Mahasatipatthana sutta has a full section which is slightly different to the above
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html

for me it is a matter of clear comprehension, you develop an awareness of what your mind state is and apply right effort toward that mind-state.
This offering maybe right, or wrong, but it is one, the other, both, or neither!
With Metta
Upāsaka Cittasanto
Blog, - Some Suttas Translated, Ajahn Chah.
"Others will misconstrue reality due to their personal perspectives, doggedly holding onto and not easily discarding them; We shall not misconstrue reality due to our own personal perspectives, nor doggedly holding onto them, but will discard them easily. This effacement shall be done."
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Re: Cittapassana?

Postby theY » Sun Nov 18, 2012 11:09 pm

Another reply just gave you a tip.

Clearly principle is in commentary of satipaṭṭānasutta-uddesa.
cittaṃ tāva ārammaṇādhipatisahajātabhūmikammavipākakiri-
yādinānattabhedānaṃ aniccādianupassanānaṃ niddesavāre āgatasarāgādi-
bhedānaṅca vasena anupassitabbaṃฯ

http://tipitaka.org/romn/cscd/s0201a.att1.xml#M1.0251

Modified version for easy to translate:
cittaṃ tāva:

1. ārammaṇādhipatisahajātabhūmikammavipākakiriyādinānattabhedānaṃ,
2. aniccādianupassanānaṃ, (and)
3. niddesavāre āgatasarāgādibhedānaṅca (came in Cittapabba of this sutta)

vasena anupassitabbaṃฯ


sub-commentary:
ārammaṇa ...pe... bhedānanti rūpādiārammaṇanānattassa nīlāditabbhedassa,
chandādiadhipatinānattassa hīnāditabbhedassa, ñāṇajhānādisahajātanānattassa
sasaṅkhārikāsaṅkhārikasavitakkāditabbhedassa, kāmāvacarādibhūminānattassa
ukkaṭṭhamajjhimāditabbhedassa,kusalādikammanānattassa devagatisaṃvatta-
niyatāditabbhedassa, kaṇhasukkavipākanānattassadiṭṭhadhammavedanīyatādi-
tabbhedassa, parittabhūmakādikiriyānānattassa tihetukāditabbhedassa
vasena anupassitabbanti yojanāฯ ādi-saddena savatthukāvatthukādinā-
nattassa puggalattayasādhāraṇāditabbhedassa ca saṅgaho daṭṭhabboฯ

http://www.tipitaka.org/romn/cscd/s0201 ... ml#M1.0347 (text in this link is more easier to read)

Guide for translation:
Knowing more it's stuffs ...is... Nearing more it, there is seem knowing your friend's birthday, dad, mom, favorite, etc., ...is... the ruler to measure about how you know-- close to, your friend.
Note: Call me for translation if someone need.
Lesson Relationship of Abhidhammatthasaṅgaha (10/31/2012)
http://tipitakanews.org/en/node/61
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