jhana among Western converts

[tiltbillings]

http://www.shin-ibs.edu/documents/pwj3-10/12Quli.pdf

[polarbuddha101]

File not found

[tiltbillings]

It should now be available. It comes from this site:

http://www.shin-ibs.edu/

[polarbuddha101]

Thanks for the article Tilt, it was interesting. Seems like it covers the jhana spectrum and viewpoints pretty well.

[Ben]

Thanks Tilt.
I look forward to reading it - especially now after having done with that damn book about the zombie apocolypse.

[Sylvester]

Something from Ven Analayo's summer lectures on the Chinese Madhyama Agama -

http://lecture2go.uni-hamburg.de/verans ... /-/v/12279

He goes into the issue from the 11th minute...

Quite funny.

[daverupa]

Something from Ven Analayo's summer lectures on the Chinese Madhyama Agama -

http://lecture2go.uni-hamburg.de/verans ... /-/v/12279

He goes into the issue from the 11th minute...

Quite funny.

I was disheartened when his Comparative Analysis of the MN failed to even mention the possibility that the Bodhisatta discovered jhana. It seems accounting for the Bodhisatta having it 'must' be accounted for with reference to his status as a Bodhisatta, but this is rather ad hoc and (nearly?) begs the question.

Isn't it simpler to posit that first jhana was discovered under the rose-apple tree & that only later was its possible efficacy recognized, whereupon the four jhanas were the foundation of subsequent exploration and development at Uruvela?

[Sylvester]

I think he attempts to explain the meaning of abuddhi in SN 2.7, and yet reconcile it with the presence of other passages suggesting that jhāna already pre-dated the Buddha. Looking at the verse in SN 2.7, there appears to be 2 variant readings to the jhānamabujjha, which leaves some uncertainty as to what exactly was meant by the verse. There's the possibility that BB's translation of the compound could be correct (abujjha as the aorist of bujjhati), but Ven T could also be correct as treating the abujjha as a past participle. Tricky issue...

PS - I have not heard this from the horse's mouth, but I hear from someone who cited someone's testimony that Ajahn Brahm has changed his mind about the practice of jhāna prior to the Bodhisatta.

[David N. Snyder]

PS - I have not heard this from the horse's mouth, but I hear from someone who cited someone's testimony that Ajahn Brahm has changed his mind about the practice of jhāna prior to the Bodhisatta.

It is kind of hard to hear with the not so good audio in my video, but Ajahn Brahm answers my question at around the 2:40 mark that one can only reach the arūpa jhanas / realms by first going through the four rūpa jhanas. And therefore, Udaka Ramaputta and Alara Kalama must have attained the rūpa jhanas, although Ajahn Brahm implies their experience and attainment may have been "jhana-lite" or not as correct as the jhanas as taught by the Buddha.

[Sylvester]

Hopefully, I'll be able to consult Ajahn Brahmali next week and see if the reported hearsay was accurate. The sense I got was that AB may be thinking of the presence or absence of Right View as the crux of the difference.