Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

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Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby thornbush » Fri Jun 26, 2009 1:20 am

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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jun 26, 2009 1:23 am

A very talented, but very odd, if not seriously disturbed, man.
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond.
SN I, 38.

Ar scáth a chéile a mhaireas na daoine.
People live in one another’s shelter.

"We eat cold eels and think distant thoughts." -- Jack Johnson
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby Jechbi » Fri Jun 26, 2009 4:13 am

Death. The one thing that could really bring his career back to life. A great business move.

From Thriller:
Michael Jackson wrote:Night creatures calling, the dead start to walk in their masquerade
There's no escaping the jaws of the alien this time

This is the end of your life

They're out to get you, there's demons closing in on every side
They will possess you unless you change that number on your dial
Now is the time for you and I to cuddle close together, yeah
All through the night I'll save you from the terror on the screen

I'll make you see

He was a rare genius. Metta to his children.
Rain soddens what is kept wrapped up,
But never soddens what is open;
Uncover, then, what is concealed,
Lest it be soddened by the rain.
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby Ben » Fri Jun 26, 2009 7:17 am

May he be happy
May he be peaceful
May he be liberated.
Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.

Taṃ nadīhi vijānātha:
sobbhesu padaresu ca,
saṇantā yanti kusobbhā,
tuṇhīyanti mahodadhī.

Sutta Nipata 3.725


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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby Jechbi » Fri Jun 26, 2009 7:51 am

Rain soddens what is kept wrapped up,
But never soddens what is open;
Uncover, then, what is concealed,
Lest it be soddened by the rain.
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby Annapurna » Fri Jun 26, 2009 2:53 pm

Image

You'll be missed, Michael.

May you find the Ultimate Truth, brother.

May you be happy. May your task be fulfilled.

I still can't believe he's gone... :(
http://www.schmuckzauberei.blogspot.com/
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby Tex » Fri Jun 26, 2009 8:55 pm

May Michael, and all who loved him, and all who didn't, be at peace and at ease.
"The serene and peaceful mind is the true epitome of human achievement."-- Ajahn Chah, Living Dhamma

"To reach beyond fear and danger we must sharpen and widen our vision. We have to pierce through the deceptions that lull us into a comfortable complacency, to take a straight look down into the depths of our existence, without turning away uneasily or running after distractions." -- Bhikkhu Bodhi
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jun 26, 2009 9:18 pm

Considering all the people who died yesterday, why do we separate out this very sad, highly troubled individual for special mention?

May all who died yesterday, today, and earlier find peace, and may their loved ones find balance in their grief.
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond.
SN I, 38.

Ar scáth a chéile a mhaireas na daoine.
People live in one another’s shelter.

"We eat cold eels and think distant thoughts." -- Jack Johnson
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby retrofuturist » Fri Jun 26, 2009 10:23 pm

Well said, Tilt.

I don't understand the disproportionate response Michael Jackson is receiving.

Metta,
Retro. :)
If you have asked me of the origination of unease, then I shall explain it to you in accordance with my understanding:
Whatever various forms of unease there are in the world, They originate founded in encumbering accumulation. (Pārāyanavagga)


Exalted in mind, just open and clearly aware, the recluse trained in the ways of the sages:
One who is such, calmed and ever mindful, He has no sorrows! -- Udana IV, 7


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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby Cittasanto » Sat Jun 27, 2009 12:23 am

Very Odd in both good and bad ways, unfortunetly he wasn't the wisest of men, but what a showman/entertainer/singer
This offering maybe right, or wrong, but it is one, the other, both, or neither!
Blog, - Some Suttas Translated, Ajahn Chah.
"Others will misconstrue reality due to their personal perspectives, doggedly holding onto and not easily discarding them; We shall not misconstrue reality due to our own personal perspectives, nor doggedly holding onto them, but will discard them easily. This effacement shall be done."
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby clw_uk » Sat Jun 27, 2009 1:09 am

"Unindicated and unknown is the length of life of those subject to death. Life is difficult and brief and bound up with suffering. There is no means by which those who are born will not die. Having reached old age, there is death. This is the natural course for a living being. With ripe fruits there is the constant danger that they will fall. In the same way, for those born and subject to death, there is always the fear of dying. Just as the pots made by a potter all end by being broken, so death is (the breaking up) of life.

"The young and old, the foolish and the wise, all are stopped short by the power of death, all finally end in death. Of those overcome by death and passing to another world, a father cannot hold back his son, nor relatives a relation. See! While the relatives are looking on and weeping, one by one each mortal is led away like an ox to slaughter.

"In this manner the world is afflicted by death and decay. But the wise do not grieve, having realized the nature of the world. You do not know the path by which they came or departed. Not seeing either end you lament in vain. If any benefit is gained by lamenting, the wise would do it. Only a fool would harm himself. Yet through weeping and sorrowing the mind does not become calm, but still more suffering is produced, the body is harmed and one becomes lean and pale, one merely hurts oneself. One cannot protect a departed one (peta) by that means. To grieve is in vain.

"By not abandoning sorrow a being simply undergoes more suffering. Bewailing the dead he comes under the sway of sorrow. See other men faring according to their deeds! Hence beings tremble here with fear when they come into the power of death. Whatever they imagine, it (turns out) quite different from that. This is the sort of disappointment that exists. Look at the nature of the world! If a man lives for a hundred years, or even more, finally, he is separated from his circle of relatives and gives up his life in the end. Therefore, having listened to the arahant,1 one should give up lamenting. Seeing a dead body, one should know, "He will not be met by me again." As the fire in a burning house is extinguished with water, so a wise, discriminating, learned and sensible man should quickly drive away the sorrow that arises, as the wind (blows off) a piece of cotton. He who seeks happiness should withdraw the arrow: his own lamentations, longings and grief.

"With the arrow withdrawn, unattached, he would attain to peace of mind; and when all sorrow has been transcended he is sorrow-free and has realized Nibbana


Buddha


http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html
“ Your mind is likewise blocked. But the right road awaits you still. Cast out your doubts, your fears and your desires, let go of grief and of hope as well, for where these rule , then the mind is their subject." Boetius
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby retrofuturist » Sat Jun 27, 2009 2:07 am

Well said, Craig.

:buddha1:

Metta,
Retro. :)
If you have asked me of the origination of unease, then I shall explain it to you in accordance with my understanding:
Whatever various forms of unease there are in the world, They originate founded in encumbering accumulation. (Pārāyanavagga)


Exalted in mind, just open and clearly aware, the recluse trained in the ways of the sages:
One who is such, calmed and ever mindful, He has no sorrows! -- Udana IV, 7


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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby Jechbi » Sat Jun 27, 2009 7:32 am

tiltbillings wrote:Considering all the people who died yesterday, why do we separate out this very sad, highly troubled individual for special mention?

This this slogan should be posted on the front door of every funeral chapel in the world. Sometimes folks can use a good laugh when they're feeling blue.
:smile:
Rain soddens what is kept wrapped up,
But never soddens what is open;
Uncover, then, what is concealed,
Lest it be soddened by the rain.
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby thornbush » Sat Jun 27, 2009 8:20 am

Jechbi wrote:
tiltbillings wrote:Considering all the people who died yesterday, why do we separate out this very sad, highly troubled individual for special mention?

This this slogan should be posted on the front door of every funeral chapel in the world. Sometimes folks can use a good laugh when they're feeling blue.
:smile:

Matter of perspective isn't it? :popcorn:
Just because the dead man cannot come back to answer such witless comments, doesn't mean his fans or sympathizers have to respond on his behalf.
This reminds me of a high school teacher who once remarked: "Even if you die today, the world won't miss you".
And I don't know what gave me the courage to retort back: "So, does that mean you are gonna carry your own casket then?" She remained silent.
Similarly, when any living being whose time is up and when Impermanence comes knocking, whether they are mentioned or not, the last honour offered for such is nothing more than a respectful token of silence or an aspiration for their next opportune rebirth. Hence, this thread.
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby retrofuturist » Sat Jun 27, 2009 8:31 am

Greetings Thornbush,

thornbush wrote:Similarly, when any living being whose time is up and when Impermanence comes knocking, whether they are mentioned or not, the last honour offered for such is nothing more than a respectful token of silence or an aspiration for their next opportune rebirth. Hence, this thread.


Frankly, I didn't respect Michael Jackson when he was alive, so don't plan to start it now that he's gone. It would be hypocritical for me to change my tune suddenly. Sure, I wish him well... but don't respect him and certainly have no intention of honouring him. The act of dying in and of itself doesn't warrant any honour.

Metta,
Retro. :)
If you have asked me of the origination of unease, then I shall explain it to you in accordance with my understanding:
Whatever various forms of unease there are in the world, They originate founded in encumbering accumulation. (Pārāyanavagga)


Exalted in mind, just open and clearly aware, the recluse trained in the ways of the sages:
One who is such, calmed and ever mindful, He has no sorrows! -- Udana IV, 7


Dharma Wheel (Mahayana / Vajrayana forum) -- Open flower ~ Open book (blog)
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby Mawkish1983 » Sat Jun 27, 2009 8:52 am

I, on the other hand, have always had a lot of respect for Michael. I try to keep in mind that if I had been born with his prevous kamma into his family by his family and made the same decisions as he, I would have been him (sort of tautological I know). A talented but inherently naive man who was abused himself by those around him aiming to make money (including but not limited to his parents, parents of his young fans and the media, wow did THEY profit from him).

He taught the world that it don't [sic] matter if you're black or white.

He instructed people to look what we've done to the world.

He advised the youth to beat it rather than fighting.

The list goes on. Throughout the child-molestation trials I defended him to my friends, fully believing he was not guilty (as he was found).

Everyone makes mistakes. Would he have dangled the baby if the media hadn't been harrassing him I wonder.

I think this thread was a great idea... any thread to commemorate someone who touched our lives after their passing is a good thing. Anyone who doesn't want to commemorate that person really doesn't need to read or post in such a thread.

I've no doubt people here have received the many 'Michael Jackson joke' text messages that have been poluting the mobile phone network over the last few days. It's sick.

I hope when I die people don't remember the mistakes I've made. I hope when I die people don't send jokes to each other about me. Who would want that? Who deserves that?

An influential man has died. I hope musical talent is pitaka and doesn't die with the body, and I hope Michael Jackson takes rebirth in an environment that would nurture but not be forceful. Who knows, maybe he'll be introduced to the dhamma next time round :)
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby tiltbillings » Sat Jun 27, 2009 9:07 am

Similarly, when any living being whose time is up and when Impermanence comes knocking, whether they are mentioned or not, the last honour offered for such is nothing more than a respectful token of silence or an aspiration for their next opportune rebirth. Hence, this thread.


Which is fine. Jackson, without question, was a higly talented individual, from whom many derived a great deal of pleasure, but he was also deeply and obviously disturbed. His was hardly a life lived with grace. And given the noise made about his death, it is not unreasonable to wonder why.
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond.
SN I, 38.

Ar scáth a chéile a mhaireas na daoine.
People live in one another’s shelter.

"We eat cold eels and think distant thoughts." -- Jack Johnson
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby Journey » Sat Jun 27, 2009 3:33 pm

Metta is characterized as that which "promotes welfare."
Its function is to "prefer well-being" rather than ill.
It manifests as a force that "removes annoyance"
and its proximate cause is the tendency to see the good side of things and beings and never the faults.

Just as with her own life
A mother shields from hurt
Her own son, her only child,
Let all-embracing thoughts
For all beings be yours.

May he be free from hostility, free from affliction, free from distress.
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby Jechbi » Sat Jun 27, 2009 5:44 pm

retrofuturist wrote:Catch!

I've been inside the very same hotel room where that happened. It's the most beautiful hotel in Berlin.

Back to topic, I think it's fascinating how we each respond in our own ways to a prominent death. The fact is that Michael Jackson touched a lot of lives, so his death will evoke a lot of responses. There's nothing wrong with that, as long as we're mindful of what's going on here.

I thought Tilt's comment was truly funny and on point, perhaps more so than he realized, because it doesn't apply just to Michael Jackson's death. Every time any one of us goes to a funeral for someone who was close to us, we could ask the same thing: Why separate out this individual for special attention? I hope people ask that question at my funeral.

One answer to that question immediately leaps to mind: Because we are human beings, social creatures, with long-established habit patterns of preferring some people over others, and preferring ourselves over everyone else. So when someone dies who has touched our lives with some impact (as Michael Jackson has done for millions of fans), then for many of us, our feelings will find expression.

This is a good thread on this board. It's a good opportunity to examine how we react to death, and how we react to the reactions of others to death.

:anjali:
Rain soddens what is kept wrapped up,
But never soddens what is open;
Uncover, then, what is concealed,
Lest it be soddened by the rain.
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Re: Michael Jackson (August 29, 1958 – June 25, 2009)

Postby appicchato » Sat Jun 27, 2009 9:12 pm

Jechbi wrote:...how we react to the reactions of others to death.

Reading some of the comments here definitely raised my eyebrows...why?...because it shows me how, that when I think I've got some kind of read on people, I really don't... :coffee:
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