Worried about Demons/Asuras

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Worried about Demons/Asuras

Postby Tom » Fri Nov 30, 2012 11:24 am

I have a situation to share with you all that's been causing me a lot of anxiety, I don't know what to do next, so I'd greatly appreciate some advice. Here's the situation: After I woke up from a dream after a nap, I had this thought that I had given "something" mentally to an asura/demon for whatever reason (not as some form of worship, just that I had sent them "something" mentally). I don't remember what exactly I mentally sent to them because my mind was in that slightly foggy just woken up state. Anyways, afterwards, I worried that maybe I accidentally "offered" them something, which obviously I didn't mean to do. However, I worried that this could attract them into my life/ attract negative energy into my life. So what I did was mentally tell my self that I was taking "it" back, if I had even given something in the first place, and created this feeling of absorption in my body (I don't mean jhana, I just mean a sense of my body "inhaling"/absorbing back whatever it was I had possibly given them, if that makes sense). I then worried if, in the process, I had accidentally taken more than just that one thing, or if I had taken something that wasn't even mine, and worried about them getting angry about that. In order to feel safe, I then created a sense of release in my body and mentally told my self that I was giving back whatever I may have taken that wasn't mine in the first place. I then worried if, in this process, I had given them something more than than just that one thing, so then once again created the absorption feeling and mentally told myself I was taking back whatever was mine in the first place. The cycle of absorption and release continued, but I never really felt satisfied. I then stopped continuing the cycle, but I was still worried if I had given them something (such as energy) that was mine, and taken something that was their's (such as their energy). Along with this, I worried if there was now some demonic presence around because of all this. Just in case, I looked up how to remove demons on this forum. I saw that people talked about reciting certain suttas, however they were only to be used in the case of a serious situation where something is actually clearly going on. One suggestion, however, was to command the demon to leave:
Sylvester wrote:From Ajahn Thanissaro's notes on the Vinaya -

A bhikkhu who kills a "non-human being" — a yakkha, nāga, or peta — or a devatā (this last is in the Commentary) incurs a thullaccaya. According to the Commentary, when a spirit possesses a human being or an animal, it can be exorcised in either of two ways. The first is to command it to leave: This causes no injury to the spirit and results in no offense.


so I repeatedly and somewhat forcefully, said something along the lines of "If there are any demons/asuras/ghosts in my presence, or in my being, or in my mind, body, soul, or in my life at all, or in my family's presence, or in my house, I'm firmly telling you to leave right now... leave... leave...leave". I repeated this multiple times, because at first I was saying it with a mental intention as if I was mentally talking to them as well, but I then worried that if by doing this I was creating a mental connection with them, so I then repeated saying this without the sense that I was also mentally talking to them. I said this all in a very low voice, because the rest of my family was sleeping, and I didn't want to sound crazy. Anyways, I eventually stopped doing this, but I worried if I had been too harsh with the way I had said it, and that I could've possibly created bad blood. I worried that if there were demons/asuras or ghosts present, they would want to hurt me since I was harsh with them, or if there weren't any demons/asuras or ghosts present, then other demons/asuras or ghosts could've picked up with what I was doing and would want to hurt me. It's giving me a lot of anxiety, so I'd like definitely appreciate advice on how you think I should deal with this.

*Note: There was no sense of any demons present, this was just all anxiety.
Last edited by Tom on Fri Nov 30, 2012 11:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Worried about Demons/Asuras

Postby Ben » Fri Nov 30, 2012 11:32 am

Charles, I don;t think you should worry about demons or asuras.
Focus instead on what is essential: sila (morality), samadhi (calm/concentration), panna (wisdom/insight).
kind regards,

Ben
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Re: Worried about Demons/Asuras

Postby Sam Vara » Fri Nov 30, 2012 11:35 am

There was no sense of any demons present, this was just all anxiety.


This is the bit I advise you to focus on. Anxiety can generate further anxiety, and this can get us imagining all sorts of things.

All that has happened here is that you have had a dream in which you might have done something that could give rise to something bad.

But you might not have done it. If you dreamed that you had just bought a horse, on awakening would you worry for long because you couldn't afford to feed and stable it? If you dreamed that you had killed someone, would you turn yourself in to the police?

And it is unlikely that you have any previous experiences of real demons or asuras, so even if you consciously and with full concentration offered something to them, you don't know anything would happen. You have no evidence for thinking that they are real.

My advice is to do calming meditation like mindfulness of breathing or metta bhavana. Or anything that reduces the anxiety.
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Re: Worried about Demons/Asuras

Postby Tom » Fri Nov 30, 2012 11:44 am

Sam Vara wrote: All that has happened here is that you have had a dream in which you might have done something that could give rise to something bad.

But you might not have done it. If you dreamed that you had just bought a horse, on awakening would you worry for long because you couldn't afford to feed and stable it? If you dreamed that you had killed someone, would you turn yourself in to the police?


I should point out that this wasn't occuring during my dream, this was all after I woke up from a dream. I only mentioned that I had just woken up from a dream before this, because I think my original action could've been somewhat related to what I had dreamt about, but that's not really the important part of this.
Last edited by Tom on Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Worried about Demons/Asuras

Postby Nyana » Fri Nov 30, 2012 11:54 am

Ben wrote:Charles, I don;t think you should worry about demons or asuras.
Focus instead on what is essential: sila (morality), samadhi (calm/concentration), panna (wisdom/insight).

:goodpost:
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Re: Worried about Demons/Asuras

Postby daverupa » Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:13 pm

SN 4.19 wrote:"Yours alone is the eye, Evil One. Yours are forms, yours is the sphere of consciousness of contact at the eye. Where no eye exists, no forms exist, no sphere of consciousness & contact at the eye exists: there, Evil One, you cannot go. Yours alone is the ear... the nose... the tongue... the body... Yours alone is the intellect, Evil One. Yours are ideas, yours is the sphere of consciousness & contact at the intellect. Where no intellect exists, no ideas exist, no sphere of consciousness of contact at the intellect exists: there, Evil One, you cannot go."

[Mara:]
Of what they say, 'This is mine'; and those who say, 'Mine': If your intellect's here, contemplative, you can't escape from me.

[The Buddha:]
What they speak of isn't mine, and I'm not one of those who speak it. Know this, Evil One: you won't even see my tracks.

Then Mara the Evil One — sad & dejected at realizing, "The Blessed One knows me; the One Well-gone knows me" — vanished right there.


:candle:
    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.
- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]
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Re: Worried about Demons/Asuras

Postby DAWN » Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:37 pm

Charles !
First of all - STOP panic !

There is nothnik what can brings you pain! The only pain that can arose is your fear.
Try to understand what is actualy your fear.
- fear to die?
- fear of pain?
- fear of hell?
- fear of what? There is no any contact ! The only door is your mind.

So!
You wondering what you ould offer to them (to your illusion). This offer, it's not obsorbtion - it's FEAR that you offer. They are made by fear, and your fear make them exist. Only what they want it's just EXIST, like us, like all beaings thay want just to exist.
So you offer them this existance. By your fear you offer a condition of their existance. Like a fly who comes to night light - it's the same.

More you fear - more they exist.

But use your buddhist compassion !
Think a little bit, they dont want your life, or our soul, or whats ever, they wants just to exist... I donk know how much you compassion is developed, but naturaly i feel compassion to them. It's sad... It's wery sad... They want exist... Imagine a little bit... I want to cry when i think about those ignorant beings... The only wah that they find to exist, it's make fragile peoples fear... I'am sure they are sorry, but they can not do another way... Exuse them, and be compassionate.

Only metta !

You know, once i dwelt at the night in some forest. It was scary the first time. And in this forest there was animals, big rats. At the begining i was scared of them, but when i putt my fear in the trash, i saw... that actualy it's not me who are afraid, but it's them who are afraid !! They felt so scary by my presence !

Dont be afraid, they feel fear more than you, it's sure. And you know why they feel fear of you? Because it's not yours existance what is conditioned by them, but is their existance what is conditioned by you...

Stop fear.

Develop your morality at the maximum.
When your morality is pure - you are not afraid by any situation, no any enemy, enywhere. Make good deads, develop your metta to all beings, not just to your ego, or your body, who even not belogns to you. There is nothing that belongs to you, even this fear...so why you feel fear? You fear to lose something?... It's realy sad, because you have nothing to be losed.

So!
Three consils:
- find what is the nature of your fear (death, hell, soul...)
- uproot this fear
- develop your morality, do good deeds, have no regrets.

There is some suttas:

Ud 1.7
When,
with regard to his own qualities,[1]
a brahman is one
who has gone beyond,
he transcends this goblin
and his pandemonium

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html

And there is an another sutta in SN, but i dont remember, when Buddha said that when a bhikkhu have a perfect morality there is no any enemy, here there or every where. True problem is morality. heart of problem is morality!
So stop cry please, there is nothing evil, and go develop your morality. Read DN1, and do only good deeds.

With metta :|
Sabbe dhamma anatta
We are not concurents...
I'am sorry for my english
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Re: Worried about Demons/Asuras

Postby khlawng » Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:57 pm

Charles, this is like a whole string of dependant origination happening right before you as you describe it textually. From a simple thought->feeling of anxiety->craving to get away from asuras/demons->your action of asking them to leave->an entire mass of suffering.

Logically speaking, why is this one particular thought any different from the other nonsense that fills our heads every second, every minute of everyday? Why pay so much attention to this one thought? Thoughts come and go all the time. When it comes, look at it and if it is of no value, no substance, set it aside and don't dwell on it. Maybe you should look at it that way.

If that doesn't help you with your anxiety, like you said there are chants that can help. Have you tried sending loving kindness to all beings around you? Especially to those asuras and demons, tell them you mean them no harm and that you have taken refuge in the triple gem. Send them merits and ask for their protection so that you can get on with your practise and maybe come back and help them when you have attained.

Hope that helps.
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Re: Worried about Demons/Asuras

Postby santa100 » Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:17 pm

It might help to know that asuras or hell dwellers or hungry ghosts are also sentient beings who're subjected to much suffering just like us humans (or even more than that). They're busy enough facing their own suffering so I don't think they'd want to bother us. That's the job of another guy (Mara)... :tongue: So send them metta and wish them well. Cultivate the Brahmaviharas and recite the Metta Sutta frequently and everything will be ok..
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html
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Re: Worried about Demons/Asuras

Postby Tom » Fri Nov 30, 2012 8:05 pm

Thank you all for the advice, I truly appreciate it.
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