Not-Thinking as a practice

General discussion of issues related to Theravada Meditation, e.g. meditation postures, developing a regular sitting practice, skillfully relating to difficulties and hindrances, etc.
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Alex123
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Re: Not-Thinking as a practice

Post by Alex123 »

danieLion wrote:So, when we're thinking, we're not experiencing? They can never occur simultaneously?
A thought is experience but what thought points to (ex: pink colorless unicorn with three horns) may not.

Furthermore, without thinking "My true Self is..." , can at that moment be Self Views? No.
SarathW
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Re: Not-Thinking as a practice

Post by SarathW »

Mr Man wrote:"experience and reflex" does that equal Vedana and Tanha?
I think it is Vedana and Sanna in terms of five aggregate.
I think it is Vedana and Phasa etc. interms of dependent origination
It can be viewed in terms of seventeen thought moments as well. Please see the link, para (Mind in its active and pasive form):

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... el322.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

They all interdependent process. No first cause.
According to Buddhism only time you do not have thought is when an Arahant is in Nirodha Samapatti state.

Please see the link:
http://www.buddhanet.net/pdf_file/printguna.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
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Mr Man
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Re: Not-Thinking as a practice

Post by Mr Man »

SarathW wrote:
Mr Man wrote:"experience and reflex" does that equal Vedana and Tanha?
I think it is Vedana and Sanna in terms of five aggregate.
I think it is Vedana and Phasa etc. interms of dependent origination
It can be viewed in terms of seventeen thought moments as well. Please see the link, para (Mind in its active and pasive form):

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... el322.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

They all interdependent process. No first cause.
According to Buddhism only time you do not have thought is when an Arahant is in Nirodha Samapatti state.

Please see the link:
http://www.buddhanet.net/pdf_file/printguna.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thanks for the links SarathW. Overly theoretical for me I'm afraid. I would be interested in hearing what your definition/understanding of "thought" is? Is it "ideas formulated into language within the brain"?
SarathW
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Re: Not-Thinking as a practice

Post by SarathW »

I know this teaching is soy profound. It took me years of reading and practice to get my head around this.
Only suggestion I can make to you is please read and practice (Satipattana) so you will find the answer yourself.
Sorry I can’t give you a direct answer. :)
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
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Mr Man
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Re: Not-Thinking as a practice

Post by Mr Man »

SarathW, here's somthing from Ajahn Sumedho: "As soon as we think about ourselves, we become a person - somebody - but when we are not thinking, the mind is quite empty and there is no sense of person. There is still consciousness, sensitivity, but it's not seen in terms of being a person, of being a man or a woman; there is just awareness of what is happening - what the feeling is, the mood, the atmosphere that one is experiencing in this moment. We can call this intuitive awareness. It is not programmed and conditioned by thought or memory or perception. " Is he talking about "Nirodha Samapatti" or the "Dhayna infinity of space"? http://www.fsnewsletter.amaravati.org/html/38/38.htm
SarathW
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Re: Not-Thinking as a practice

Post by SarathW »

Hi Mr.Man
I think he is talking about radiant consiousness. I may be wrong. I asked a similar questin in attached link.

http://www.dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=15567" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
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kirk5a
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Re: Not-Thinking as a practice

Post by kirk5a »

Mr Man wrote:SarathW, here's somthing from Ajahn Sumedho: "As soon as we think about ourselves, we become a person - somebody - but when we are not thinking, the mind is quite empty and there is no sense of person. There is still consciousness, sensitivity, but it's not seen in terms of being a person, of being a man or a woman; there is just awareness of what is happening - what the feeling is, the mood, the atmosphere that one is experiencing in this moment. We can call this intuitive awareness. It is not programmed and conditioned by thought or memory or perception. " Is he talking about "Nirodha Samapatti" or the "Dhayna infinity of space"? http://www.fsnewsletter.amaravati.org/html/38/38.htm
I think he's just talking about ordinary awareness but when, through developing a reasonably stable degree of wakefulness and concentration, the mental blather quiets down and imaginings fade away...
"When one thing is practiced & pursued, ignorance is abandoned, clear knowing arises, the conceit 'I am' is abandoned, latent tendencies are uprooted, fetters are abandoned. Which one thing? Mindfulness immersed in the body." -AN 1.230
pegembara
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Re: Not-Thinking as a practice

Post by pegembara »

http://www.dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=609" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
“‘Consciousness without surface,
without end,
luminous all around:
Here water, earth, fire, & wind
have no footing.
And what is right speech? Abstaining from lying, from divisive speech, from abusive speech, & from idle chatter: This is called right speech.
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Mr Man
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Re: Not-Thinking as a practice

Post by Mr Man »

kirk5a wrote: I think he's just talking about ordinary awareness but when, through developing a reasonably stable degree of wakefulness and concentration, the mental blather quiets down and imaginings fade away...
Exactly. And that is the beauty of the practice. It is here and now, It is not complicated, we don't need special states or conditions. Just a bit of a framework and some diligence.
SarathW
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Re: Not-Thinking as a practice

Post by SarathW »

I think animal or a newly born children do not have self-awareness (ego). They just live day by day. I do not think they can become arahants because their rebirth consciousness is conditioned by attachment, aversion and ignorance. I am glad to see that Ajhan Sumedho seems to think that attaining arhantship is child play. I wish I can think the same! :)
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
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