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nimitta for jhana - Dhamma Wheel

nimitta for jhana

The cultivation of calm or tranquility and the development of concentration
alan...
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nimitta for jhana

Postby alan... » Tue Jan 29, 2013 5:11 am

is it possible that the commentators used this method because one of the popular methods for them was kasina practice which immediately involves a nimitta and it is integral for the entire process, so perhaps they just kept using it with anapanasati and everything else even though it's not in the suttas? and further that today since kasina practice is not common, some may never see a nimitta, even if they could otherwise master jhana meditation, they simply will not see a nimitta or at least not on any consistent basis. however that same person could see one if they had practiced kasina meditation first.

how much is visualization and how much is naturally occuring? how much is lack of visual stimulation causing visual "noise" (related to the ) and how much is only in the mind (in the case of non-kasina practice). would a blind person who did not know of or practice kasina be able to see nimitta?


any thoughts and ideas are welcome.

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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby Sekha » Tue Jan 29, 2013 5:59 am

Where knowledge ends, religion begins. - B. Disraeli

http://www.buddha-vacana.org

alan...
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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby alan... » Tue Jan 29, 2013 6:03 am


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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby Sekha » Tue Jan 29, 2013 6:15 am

visual noise or not, round or not, bowl or not it doesn't matter. The more you think about those things imho the more you are hindering your practice. The nimitta appears when the mind becomes concentrated. If you are working with the breath, it appears faster if you breathe naturally, and for that it is better not to focus on in-and-out breaths, only on the breath as a whole. That's right: it means you are actually not practicing aana-apaanaa-ssati (mindfulness of in-and-out-breaths), but imo you are preparing yourself for the light kasina.
Where knowledge ends, religion begins. - B. Disraeli

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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby alan... » Tue Jan 29, 2013 6:23 am


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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby mikenz66 » Tue Jan 29, 2013 6:35 am


alan...
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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby alan... » Tue Jan 29, 2013 6:40 am


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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby Sylvester » Tue Jan 29, 2013 6:46 am


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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby Sekha » Tue Jan 29, 2013 6:51 am

Where knowledge ends, religion begins. - B. Disraeli

http://www.buddha-vacana.org

alan...
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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby alan... » Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:32 am


alan...
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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby alan... » Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:41 am


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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby Zom » Tue Jan 29, 2013 9:34 am

Forms here mean devas. There's a sutta in AN confirming this.
As far as I remember Ven. Bodhi explained this light-and-forms as the development of the Divine Eye (but still as we know there are arahants with no divine eye).

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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby daverupa » Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:40 am

The exemplifies nimitta in terms of the "nimitta of ones mind" with respect to the "nimitta of ones master" and his preference for this or that foodstuff on any given day, which a skilled cook will then incorporate.

So daily one cooks satipatthana for ones mind, carefully noting the mind's preferences and picking up that nimitta. "As a result, he is rewarded with a pleasant abiding here & now, together with mindfulness & alertness.".

Pleasant abidings here and now are jhana.

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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby gendun » Tue Jan 29, 2013 12:50 pm

If it seems likely that I am about to put a brake on the debate please feel free to take appropriate action moderators :anjali:
In the tradition in which I attempt to practise , nimitta (plural ? ) are seen as just another phenomenon to be noted and pretty much ignored.
Sorry to ask something so basic , but how does that differ in practise from the Theravada ?
Imagine that you are addressing someone reasonably bright but very green in these specific matters.

:anjali:
Gendun P. Brownlow.
Karma Kagyu student.

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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby alan... » Tue Jan 29, 2013 7:22 pm


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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby Sylvester » Wed Jan 30, 2013 1:53 am


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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby daverupa » Wed Jan 30, 2013 2:22 am


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tiltbillings
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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby tiltbillings » Wed Jan 30, 2013 3:27 am

Moderator note: This thread was moved here, allowing for a more broad based discussion, in that it did not quite fit the more limiting guidelines for the classical section.

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Re: nimitta for jhana

Postby Sylvester » Wed Jan 30, 2013 5:56 am


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daverupa
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Re: nimitta for jhana

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