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Heaven, Hell, etc. - Dhamma Wheel

Heaven, Hell, etc.

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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Jay1
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Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2013 11:37 pm

Heaven, Hell, etc.

Postby Jay1 » Mon Feb 04, 2013 7:41 pm

I'm shocked that Buddhism, a seemingly secular religion...lol, would teach these things. And devas!!!

Why/How does one manage to believe such things?

:namaste:

Coyote
Posts: 845
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 12:42 pm
Location: Wales - UK

Re: Heaven, Hell, etc.

Postby Coyote » Mon Feb 04, 2013 8:06 pm

"If beings knew, as I know, the results of giving & sharing, they would not eat without having given, nor would the stain of miserliness overcome their minds. Even if it were their last bite, their last mouthful, they would not eat without having shared."
Iti 26

perkele
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Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2011 2:37 pm

Re: Heaven, Hell, etc.

Postby perkele » Mon Feb 04, 2013 8:16 pm

The Buddha never advertised his teaching as a "secular religion". Whatever that term is supposed to mean. To me it means nothing meaningful. :broke:
To my understanding, the Buddha taught about the reality of experience, because he understood it completely. Now that's meaningful to me. Don't know if that conveys any meaning to you.
We believe all kinds of stuff. What do you believe happens to your experience when your body breaks apart?

matais
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:04 am

Re: Heaven, Hell, etc.

Postby matais » Mon Feb 04, 2013 9:37 pm

The reason the Buddha taught his followers about heaven, hell, devas, etc is because doing so would convince his followers that their actions made a difference even after death. The buddha never taught anyone to worship a deva though, and rather than saying that people should try to go to heaven, as is common in many other religions, the Buddha taught a path towards liberation from rebirth (and thereby liberation from suffering) altogether.

I can believe this because I've (at least tentatively) accepted the Buddha as a perfectly enlightened being who taught the Dhamma to his followers for the purpose of their liberation, based on those parts of the Dhamma that I can empirically verify, and because I see no harm in believing them. Quite the contrary - I hope these beliefs can turn me into a better person.

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LonesomeYogurt
Posts: 900
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:24 pm
Location: America

Re: Heaven, Hell, etc.

Postby LonesomeYogurt » Mon Feb 04, 2013 10:02 pm

Gain and loss, status and disgrace,
censure and praise, pleasure and pain:
these conditions among human beings are inconstant,
impermanent, subject to change.

Knowing this, the wise person, mindful,
ponders these changing conditions.
Desirable things don’t charm the mind,
undesirable ones bring no resistance.

His welcoming and rebelling are scattered,
gone to their end,
do not exist.
- Lokavipatti Sutta


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SDC
Posts: 3633
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2009 11:08 pm

Re: Heaven, Hell, etc.

Postby SDC » Mon Feb 04, 2013 10:32 pm

I believe in trolls.

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ground
Posts: 2591
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 6:01 am

Re: Heaven, Hell, etc.

Postby ground » Tue Feb 05, 2013 2:15 am


pegembara
Posts: 1140
Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:39 am

Re: Heaven, Hell, etc.

Postby pegembara » Tue Feb 05, 2013 2:43 am

`These things lead to dispassion, not to passion; to detachment,
not to attachment; to dispersal, not to amassing; to modesty, not to
ambition; to content, not to discontent; to seclusion, not to association;
to energy, not to idleness; to frugality, not to luxury,' of them
you can quite certainly decide: `This is the Dhamma, this is the Discipline,
this is the Master's teaching.' "
And what is right speech? Abstaining from lying, from divisive speech, from abusive speech, & from idle chatter: This is called right speech.

barcsimalsi
Posts: 385
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2011 7:33 am

Re: Heaven, Hell, etc.

Postby barcsimalsi » Tue Feb 05, 2013 4:33 am


whynotme
Posts: 479
Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2011 5:52 am

Re: Heaven, Hell, etc.

Postby whynotme » Thu Feb 14, 2013 7:37 pm

Well, kalama sutta is one of the best human can get, but if you only quoted the first half, it is pointless. The later part and also the right understanding the kalama sutta are more important

At first the Buddha said should not put faith easily (but on many other suttas he said should believe in him, the awaken one)
Then later he said one must judge based on wisdom, and the possibility: if those things exist what would you get and lost? If those things don't exist then what would you get and lost (2000 years before Descarte, in a much better manner) IMO, that part is much more important, it show the perfect wisdom right there, not any bad word can be said against kalama sutta as a whole

Regards
Please stop following me

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Kim OHara
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Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 5:47 am
Location: North Queensland, Australia

Re: Heaven, Hell, etc.

Postby Kim OHara » Fri Feb 15, 2013 10:52 am


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Bhikkhu Pesala
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Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2009 8:17 pm

Re: Heaven, Hell, etc.

Postby Bhikkhu Pesala » Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:07 pm

• • • • (Upasampadā: 24th June, 1979)

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Kim OHara
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Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 5:47 am
Location: North Queensland, Australia

Re: Heaven, Hell, etc.

Postby Kim OHara » Mon Feb 18, 2013 3:37 am



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